Official Bimmerpost Photo Contest #21: Symmetry

[Seminole]

Originally Posted by Chewy734

Cool shot man... I like the perspective.

Thanks!

Originally Posted by UdubBadger

wow nice, it is too bad bout those vines but oh well.

Ya, they had ledges so people couldn't attempt to jump off. It was already a 3 foot reach just to take that picture, so there was no way I could have safely held the vines out of the way and taken the picture at the same time. I only got two hands!

[UdubBadger]

yeah sometimes shots workout that way. I mean its not like someone can come along and take the picture without them, or you just didn't think about it. You can only work with what it gives ya.

[TL]

here's my attempt....

[MetsFan]

The Clock Tower

[scollins]

Man, I'm struggling with this one. Finding symmetry is not the problem, I'm surrounded by it. The problem is creating a compelling image!!

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by scollins

Man, I'm struggling with this one. Finding symmetry is not the problem, I'm surrounded by it. The problem is creating a compelling image!!

+1

[///MWA]

Workers

[scollins]

"Old School Shell"

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by ///MWA

Workers

that seems a lot more like repetition than symmetry to me...

[BMW F22]

Originally Posted by ///MWA

Workers

Originally Posted by UdubBadger

that seems a lot more like repetition than symmetry to me...

That looks like symmetry to me. IMO symmetry doesn't necessarily mean that you can slice the picture down the middle and it would look exactly the same. Symmetry could be a picture of the railroads, parallel lines, etc. You're probably thinking of symmetrical vs asymmetrical.

[UdubBadger]

well I was going with the specific definition of symmetry... seen here:

sym·me·try (sm-tr)
n. pl. sym·me·tries
1. Exact correspondence of form and constituent configuration on opposite sides of a dividing line or plane or about a center or an axis.

trust me not trying to be a nazi here, just want some form of continuity between images so the voting/judging can be on the same elements instead of all over the place with no clear cut definition of the key elements of what we should be looking for in a winner.

[BMW F22]

I think that needs to be more clearly specified.

From Webster:
1 : balanced proportions; also : beauty of form arising from balanced proportions
2 : the property of being symmetrical; especially : correspondence in size, shape, and relative position of parts on opposite sides of a dividing line or median plane or about a center or axis — compare bilateral symmetry, radial symmetry
3 : a rigid motion of a geometric figure that determines a one-to-one mapping onto itself
4 : the property of remaining invariant under certain changes (as of orientation in space, of the sign of the electric charge, of parity, or of the direction of time flow) —used of physical phenomena and of equations describing them

What I got from those definitions is that symmetry can be loosely defined as long as there is balance. Balance is very subjective thus it's being used loosely.

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by BMW E90

I think that needs to be more clearly specified.

From Webster:
1 : balanced proportions; also : beauty of form arising from balanced proportions
2 : the property of being symmetrical; especially : correspondence in size, shape, and relative position of parts on opposite sides of a dividing line or median plane or about a center or axis — compare bilateral symmetry, radial symmetry
3 : a rigid motion of a geometric figure that determines a one-to-one mapping onto itself
4 : the property of remaining invariant under certain changes (as of orientation in space, of the sign of the electric charge, of parity, or of the direction of time flow) —used of physical phenomena and of equations describing them

What I got from those definitions is that symmetry can be loosely defined as long as there is balance. Balance is very subjective thus it's being used loosely.

right but if we just wanted the theme to Balanced don't you think we should have just named it "Balance" instead of going a step further and making it "Symmetry"? Because we went the extra step to make it that, I figure we should go by the stricter definition.

[BMW F22]

The contest said "architectural" which would include all the building pix. Sure you could take it straight on so that it's symmetrical but by taking it from a different angle, ///MWA has given the picture an interesting perspective. I think for this contest we should just include all the pictures if it even remotely resembles symmetry. Keep in mind that we're collectively running this contest because the last winner seems to be MIA. Besides, if symmetry strictly means that the picture should be exactly the same on both sides then almost all pictures do not qualify because if you drew a line down the middle, very few pictures are symmetrical. Just something to think about...

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by BMW E90

Besides, if symmetry strictly means that the picture should be exactly the same on both sides then almost all pictures do not qualify because if you drew a line down the middle, very few pictures are symmetrical.

my point exactly...

its not whether the building split down the middle is symmetrical... its does the photo show its symmetry.

think about this? Is a mountain range symmetrical? Hardly... nature is rarely symmetrical especially in on such a grand scale.

Yet this example photo is of a mountain range and symmetrical isn't it?


That is my point. You can take non symmetrical things and make them symmetrical if you are creative. To take something already symmetrical and show it in a non symmetrical form isn't symmetrical anymore. The point is to SHOW the symmetry, not hide it.

[BMW F22]

^ Wow that's a great picture! For a second I thought that was yours and was thinking "wow we have a winner" lol. But yeah I know exactly what you're talking about. All I'm saying is that if we are strictly defining "symmetry" then most of the pix submitted don't fit the theme. If that's the case we would have like 3 pix to vote on. Where's the fun in that?

Anyhow, here's my submission- Evening Swim

[BMW F22]

Originally Posted by Railgun

Then why not call the category reflections?

I guess to further bring the point of the rule set, that should be explicitly defined.

The definitions have already been posted. Point is, those submissions are what the photographer has interpreted the meaning to be.

If the issue is that there's no image that contains a reflection, perhaps symmetry wasn't the correct theme to use for what your intentions were.

That being said, based on the rules, all the images are suitable IMHO.

Exactly- thank you! That's why I think virtually all the pictures submitted do fit the theme.

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by Railgun

Then why not call the category reflections?

I guess to further bring the point of the rule set, that should be explicitly defined.

For example...





The definitions have already been posted. Point is, those submissions are what the photographer has interpreted the meaning to be.

If the issue is that there's no image that contains a reflection, perhaps symmetry wasn't the correct theme to use for what your intentions were.

That being said, based on the rules, all the images are suitable IMHO.

Originally Posted by BMW E90

Exactly- thank you! That's why I think virtually all the pictures submitted do fit the theme.

you guys crack me up.

there isn't something that says reflection has to be in it... I only was showing an example of how to capture symmetry with something NON symmetrical (something available to everyone).

My point is yes, most of these images submitted couldn't be folded in half somewhere in the photo and have a CLOSE (I'm not even saying it needs to be exact) symmetrical quality of each side. Do you want to have a contest that dictates what photos fit into it by following it's theme correctly or do you want a contest that the photos submitted dictate how loosely we follow the given theme because nobody gets it? Where does the line stop then? You can't pull the "Any interpretation of the theme that falls within Bimmerpost.com rules is welcome" card because in this case it's either symmetrical or its not, its not like "kind of symmetrical" - there is no such thing.

Just because 10 people submit photos that don't fit doesn't mean we should still allow them. Then what is the point of having any rules? If my pic is 801px by 800px should it then be included? If I don't have a title but a title is required should it be included? Where do we draw that line?

Plus what is the rush? I personally have no problem saying it was misunderstood so lets start over. Extend the contest so we are all on the same page as to what is acceptable and what isn't and all have a fair chance at submitting a photo that actually has some symmetry to it.

Whatever, that's my $.02, take it for what it's worth.

[vachss]

Originally Posted by UdubBadger

Just because 10 people submit photos that don't fit doesn't mean we should still allow them. Then what is the point of having any rules? ...

The point, I would hope, is to encourage forum readers to participate and be creative.

This insistence on precise adherence to rules is really starting to make me sad. This is a small contest on a small forum and one could easily make it so restrictive that nobody participates. Is that really what you want?

My take is that, henceforward, the spirit of the photo contests should be inclusive rather than exclusive. Forum members vote on the results. If forum members don't like a picture or disagree with its interpretation of the contest's theme then they shouldn't vote for it. Period. No other corrective mechanism is needed.

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by vachss

The point, I would hope, is to encourage forum readers to participate and be creative.

This insistence on precise adherence to rules is really starting to make me sad. This is a small contest on a small forum and one could easily make it so restrictive that nobody participates. Is that really what you want?

My take is that, henceforward, the spirit of the photo contests should be inclusive rather than exclusive. Forum members vote on the results. If forum members don't like a picture or disagree with its interpretation of the contest's theme then they shouldn't vote for it. Period. No other corrective mechanism is needed.

Well I agree partially but maybe you should go back and check SOME of the voting on the previous contests... the one that fits the theme the best doesn't always win. Remember people who don't frequent this section much sometimes see the poll and vote for which ever one has the prettiest colors or the coolest looking car in it.

Whatever, lets just move on. I guess nobody see's it the same way I do. I'm not trying to make it exclusive to anyone or not include anyone of any skill level. I just wish people would try to adhere to the simple rules we have in place, its not hard and if you have a question or don't know if it fits, you can always ask to resubmit a photo that does. The point of these contests is to let EVERYONE compete in them, just as much as is a chance for everyone to go out and shoot more and LEARN more and get better. I just don't see how anyone learns or gets better if we allow their photos that might not fit.

[BMW F22]

Yeah I agree with Udub that people usually vote on the picture(s) that is/are attractive to them and not necessarily the ones that fit the theme the best. But like someone else said, there's nothing we can do because it's mainly a car forum.

Anyhow, UDUB, I completely understand where you're coming from because you're thinking of symmetrical things (or asymmetrical things that could be symmetrical). The thing is that that's just one interpretation of what symmetry is. I mean in your opinion some don't fit the theme but in mine (and others) they do. So I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. I mean yes I'm all for following the theme closely but "symmetry" unfortunately could be interpreted in many ways (reflections, balance, split down the middle thing, etc.).

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by BMW E90

Yeah I agree with Udub that people usually vote on the picture(s) that is/are attractive to them and not necessarily the ones that fit the theme the best. But like someone else said, there's nothing we can do because it's mainly a car forum.

Anyhow, UDUB, I completely understand where you're coming from because you're thinking of symmetrical things (or asymmetrical things that could be symmetrical). The thing is that that's just one interpretation of what symmetry is. I mean in your opinion some don't fit the theme but in mine (and others) they do. So I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. I mean yes I'm all for following the theme closely but "symmetry" unfortunately could be interpreted in many ways (reflections, balance, split down the middle thing, etc.).

well not to beat a dead horse cuz I said I was done but those 3 things you listed would all be fine, yet I don't see ANY of them in some of the pics posted which was why I had a problem with them.