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      04-19-2018, 05:40 PM   #89
rathesungod
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanyam89 View Post
Sorry, for the late reply.

Yes, I had to refill the lost fluid. The container is right next to the hydraulic pump in the trunk. As Tangent mentioned, the bubbles in the hoses did cause the top to jerk for a couple of seconds but after that it was smooth as before. I added a little more fluid after the air escaped the hose.
I used hydraulic fluid from Febi, it was $21 for 1 liter. Way cheaper than BMW fluid.
Sanyam89, Do you think two of those couplers would fit? both of my lines are cracked on the same side.
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      02-11-2019, 11:49 PM   #90
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Has anyone else found any info or posts, besides what is in this thread, about fixing this problem themselves instead of paying BMW?
I've looked and looked and this is the only place I have found anything useful.

Major spraying of fluid on passenger side of the car. Haven't been able to get a visual on any actual hose damage.

2013 Z4 s28i

Thanks,
Marv
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      02-12-2019, 10:18 AM   #91
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My vehicle production date is 11-14-2012. Safe to assume I have the newer convertible top system?
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      04-07-2019, 02:13 PM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryanhoag View Post
My vehicle production date is 11-14-2012. Safe to assume I have the newer convertible top system?
Please don't assume. Just check the lines periodically.

I checked mine past weekend and I could definitely see some chafing which was not there a couple of years ago.

What can we do to protect the line ? Is there any tape recommended ? Any ideas ? Thanks.
Attached Images
 

Last edited by BugsBunny; 04-07-2019 at 02:35 PM..
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      07-08-2019, 08:35 AM   #93
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How do you prevent the top from closing on its own?

Hello everyone, I have the same hydraulic leak on the L side. Just to keep track of how often this happens, I have a 2010 Z4 with 43000Mil.

I am having a hard time finding the exact location because the top keeps closing on its own after few minutes of being partially open.

Is there a way to keep it partially open, like a maintenance mode, without the risk of being decapitated?

I guess I could partially open it and then somehow disconnect the battery. Not practical. Maybe a fuse.

Thx
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      07-08-2019, 01:39 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoloZ4 View Post
I am having a hard time finding the exact location because the top keeps closing on its own after few minutes of being partially open.

Is there a way to keep it partially open, like a maintenance mode, without the risk of being decapitated?

I guess I could partially open it and then somehow disconnect the battery. Not practical. Maybe a fuse.

Thx
Just to make sure I understand: you obviously switched off the car (keyfob out and away) and still after a few minutes, the top keeps closing ? Correct ?
Before disconnecting the battery, I would recommend to see how to switch off the hydraulic pump (which sits in the trunk next to the battery). There might be a fuse / relay to power off the hydraulic pump. You might PM RobbiZ4 or post that question on the infamous thread called "Top Issues".

Cheers
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      07-09-2019, 11:27 AM   #95
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Hi guys,

didn't mention this thread before (or did I and forgot it? )
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      07-09-2019, 11:30 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
[...]Also would like to know if OP has the newer/better roof mechanism (presumably not since it's MY2010?)? I don't have it either, my MY2011 was apparently the last yr w/ the old tech, not to mention the lousy double flappy paddles aargggh.
These are only rumors. There was never mounted a "better" mechanism in the car. Quality is the same on all cars from 2009 up to 2016!

The only difference is a 4th hydraulic valve on the hydraulic pump as of 2012. It forces the hydraulic pressure to open/close the roof while driving, as this was offered since spring 2012. The "newer" harness got a new part number as 2 additional wires were added from the CTM to this 4th valve.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryanhoag View Post
My vehicle production date is 11-14-2012. Safe to assume I have the newer convertible top system?
No.


Pse apologize, but my expectation from 2 dozens of examined and repaired E89 roofs is, that all hydraulic hoses of this roof shell will break at the age of 10-12 years.

Last edited by RobbiZ4; 07-09-2019 at 11:50 AM..
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      07-09-2019, 12:31 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoloZ4 View Post
...because the top keeps closing on its own after few minutes of being partially open.

Is there a way to keep it partially open, like a maintenance mode, without the risk of being decapitated?
I guess I could partially open it and then somehow disconnect the battery. Not practical. Maybe a fuse.
Thx
After the hydraulic pump stops, the pressure in the hoses is lowering after 1-2 minutes. The roof shell will come down by its own weight.

You can put a tool between the levers on each side like in the following pictures:





Last edited by RobbiZ4; 07-09-2019 at 12:37 PM..
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      07-11-2019, 06:42 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobbiZ4 View Post
These are only rumors. There was never mounted a "better" mechanism in the car. Quality is the same on all cars from 2009 up to 2016!

The only difference is a 4th hydraulic valve on the hydraulic pump as of 2012. It forces the hydraulic pressure to open/close the roof while driving, as this was offered since spring 2012. The "newer" harness got a new part number as 2 additional wires were added from the CTM to this 4th valve.



No.


Pse apologize, but my expectation from 2 dozens of examined and repaired E89 roofs is, that all hydraulic hoses of this roof shell will break at the age of 10-12 years.
Well, it's better as it allows for operation while moving vs the older version which is virtually only at a standstill.
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      07-12-2019, 02:20 AM   #99
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To be honest, this last reply is nonsense!
What is "better" regarding the above quality discussion? Any fundanentals from you as well?

The "rumours" are discussing about a better quality with the FL: There is none! I"ve already repaired the wires of a facelift model.

There was only a software feature activation in 2012 by BMW.
Each even elder Z4 is able to open the roof while moving if an additional roof modul got mounted (XCarStyle,...).

Last edited by RobbiZ4; 07-12-2019 at 02:33 AM..
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      07-12-2019, 06:11 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobbiZ4 View Post
To be honest, this last reply is nonsense!
What is "better" regarding the above quality discussion? Any fundanentals from you as well?

The "rumours" are discussing about a better quality with the FL: There is none! I"ve already repaired the wires of a facelift model.

There was only a software feature activation in 2012 by BMW.
Each even elder Z4 is able to open the roof while moving if an additional roof modul got mounted (XCarStyle,...).
Jesus, why are you having a rage out? I've asked and apparently it's not just a simple software upgrade or else I would've jumped all over it. They supposedly made the structure hardier, hence why they can operate at some speed vs older ones that can only operate basically at a standstill.

EDIT:
Since you decided to dig up my post from 5 years ago, the whole discussion was trying to figure out what happened to that guy's car and the presumption that the newer roof is hardier since it can operate at higher speeds; we're wondering if he overridden w the old mechanism and caused unintentional damage by operating while moving. I can't be bothered to find the post(s) but I asked other members and apparently it's not just a simple software upgrade and something structural.

I'll be glad to be wrong and you can pt me in the right direction. I'm sceptical or else they would've offered it and make more money off of us.

Last edited by tranquility; 07-12-2019 at 06:27 PM..
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      07-13-2019, 03:22 AM   #101
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Nothing has changed, neither in the structure nor in the quality. But why not, trust the rumours and be happy.:

Last edited by RobbiZ4; 07-13-2019 at 01:59 PM..
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      07-13-2019, 12:02 PM   #102
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Lol, those pix don't show anything.

Where's the upgrade pkg so I can send my money?
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      07-13-2019, 06:45 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsBunny View Post
Please don't assume. Just check the lines periodically.

I checked mine past weekend and I could definitely see some chafing which was not there a couple of years ago.

What can we do to protect the line ? Is there any tape recommended ? Any ideas ? Thanks.
Try out Silicone Tape. I'm not sure how much pressure it can hold but I have use it on water hose that have small leak for years and it's working fine.

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-...3240986&rt=rud
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      07-26-2019, 08:52 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pierreye View Post
Try out Silicone Tape. I'm not sure how much pressure it can hold but I have use it on water hose that have small leak for years and it's working fine.

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-...3240986&rt=rud


40psi water is not the same as 2000+psi oil.
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      07-31-2019, 05:20 PM   #105
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Roof Hydraulics

Hi, I'm a recent forum member and have a couple of questions regarding the roof hydraulics. I own a 2009 Z4 Sdrive30i and have had it for three years. Last year, I had a hydraulic leak on the passenger side. I took it to BMW dealership and they recommended replacement of the complete harness. The repair cost approximately $1800. Soon after, I put the car into storage for the winter. Upon taking the car out in the Spring, the car developed a problem whereby during phase 1 activation of opening the roof where the panel with the rear window opens, on occasion, the right side seems to actuate a second or so slower than the left side causing the sequence to be slightly out of synch. This only happens occasionally, i.e., every ten times or so. Now that I recognize this happening, I stop the operation, reverse it, start again and usually it will work fine the next time. I took the car into BMW and they advise replacing the hydraulic unit at a cost of approximately $3600 since they believe the unit is starting to fail. I've discussed this with some mechanic friends as well as researched a bit on-line and and am starting to believe the issue might be a faulty or sticky solenoid valve or possibly problems with the salmon relay switches. I'm wondering if anyone has some advice. Thanks. Paolo
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      07-31-2019, 06:13 PM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paolo B View Post
[...]the car developed a problem whereby during phase 1 activation of opening the roof where the panel with the rear window opens, on occasion, the right side seems to actuate a second or so slower than the left side causing the sequence to be slightly out of synch.
This only happens occasionally, i.e., every ten times or so. Now that I recognize this happening, I stop the operation, reverse it, start again and usually it will work fine the next time.

I took the car into BMW and they advise replacing the hydraulic unit at a cost of approximately $3600 since they believe the unit is starting to fail. I've discussed this with some mechanic friends as well as researched a bit on-line and and am starting to believe the issue might be a faulty or sticky solenoid valve or possibly problems with the salmon relay switches. [...]
Hi Paolo,
Is it correct, that the hydraulic loom has been replaced by a new one by BMW?
Then everything should be fine with the hydraulic hoses as well as with the electrical wires.

The two salmon relais manage the directions the hydraulic motor turns. There are 3 states, OFF, turn left and turn right. From my experience (>20 roof repairs) the relays are not the source of this problem.

Here you will find an overview of the hydraulic parts:
https://www.realoem.com/bmw/en/showp...diagId=54_0402

The pump supports each pair of hydraulic cylinders in parallel, not individually. This is documented in a public hydraulic circuit diagram I'm aware of.
If the hydraulic cylinders on the left and on the right work with a different speed, I assume there is more a less a problem in one of the cylinders, not in the pump.

Already some minutes ago I got a very fast replay from TopHydraulics.
Might be an option for you as well to talk to one of their engineers about your specific problem.

Contact:

Top Hydraulics, Inc.
3235 Pacific View Dr.
Florence, OR 97439
+1 (541) 902 3214

www.tophydraulics.com

Making your convertible top hydraulics better than new with the highest quality seals and components

Last edited by RobbiZ4; 08-03-2019 at 05:26 PM..
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      07-31-2019, 06:26 PM   #107
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Hi Robbi, Thanks for the quick reply. The BMW dealership did say that the problem might also be a bent or damaged hydraulic cylinder on the right side of roof. However, they recommended changing the hydraulic unit first and if that didn't resolve the problem, then consider changing the cylinder. Very expensive trial and error! I have been in touch with Klaus at Top Hydraulics and he was helpful but unsure of what the problem might be. I am considering using his service to rebuild my hydraulic unit but thought about changing a solenoid valve and changing the relays first. Relatively cheap options and if unsuccessful, proceed with the hydro rebuild service from Top Hydraulics. If that fails, I may need to replace the cylinder. I ordered a solenoid valve from Roofmotors.uk.com so will try that first and then will install the two new relays I ordered from ECS Tuning. One more question. Since I have a new harness, I assume it has four sets of wires for the new four valve hydro unit. I'm not 100% certain, but I believe so. If this is the case and I replace my hydraulic unit with a four valve unit, will I be able to activate the roof while in motion? Will I need a software upgrade or is it simply plug and play? I have Carly and have re-programmed the roof to open while in motion but don't really use it because I'm afraid it might damage the roof. Thanks for your advice. Paolo
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      08-01-2019, 03:45 AM   #108
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Hi Paolo,

Tonight I had a call with Klaus as well. We talked about a lot of technical details and I'd say you can rely on him and his recommendations. But don't trust the BMW guys, same here in Germany. They only try around and have to make cash without any experiences :-(

The relays have to be replaced all 5 years to avoid melted pumps, but that it is not the source of your problem. But do it immediately.

The results of my analysis were posted in the German Z4 forum. I made the recommendation to get these two relays replaced let’s say every 5 years.
https://www.zroadster.com/forum/thre...-jahre.133521/

Thanks to Google Translate you can read it in English as well:
https://translate.google.com/transla...ahre.133521%2F



To use the 4th selenoid you also need a newer CTM (cabrio top module) to manage this fourth channel.

Opening while driving is an option you can activate by carly, but I've mounted an additional module from XCarStyle here in Germany. With this I can open/close it while driving and much more important, I can open AND close the roof remotely by the key.


Details about the E89 roof construction:
https://www.zroadster.com/forum/thre.../#post-2773183

With Roofmotors.uk.com I made very bad experiences:
At first he delivered a refurbished pump that did not work. Then there was a huge delay to refund.
My 2nd order got cancelled after I've paid the money and then we run into the same refunding problem. Just keep away of it.

The new harness from BMW (about 1 k€ in Germany) always has the additional wires for the 4th selenoid. If it's not required you can leave it unplugged.

Each side has a lenght of about 3m and is connected in the middle at the hydraulic pump's position. It contains the 2x6 hydraulic hoses as well as all wires for micro switches and hall sensors, all connectors and even the plugs for the two salmon relays.

Last edited by RobbiZ4; 08-01-2019 at 07:40 AM..
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      08-01-2019, 07:10 AM   #109
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Hi Robi, thanks again for your advice and expert information. I do have confidence in Top Hydraulics based on my discussion with them and other information I've read. I'm trying to determine what I should try first, replace/rebuild the hydraulic unit or replace the right roof cylinder. I want to try and minimize my expenditures. The roof mechanism generally works so I'm waiting until the Fall to do the repairs. I tend to think the problem is the cylinder however thought I'd try swapping a solenoid valve, one at a time and see if anything improves. I had read your thread about the salmon relays so will be changing those even if they aren't the source of the problem. I'll let you know how I make out. Regarding the Carly coding to allow the roof to open while in motion, do you think the existing hydraulic unit is robust enough to utilize this option without the extra module or do you think this can cause me problems. As i mentioned previously, I haven't really been using the option in motion as I fear it may cause problems however have used it when moving very slowly, i.e., 5-10 kms/hr. Thanks again for your expertise. It sure is great to have experts like you to share information with. Paolo
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      08-01-2019, 07:36 AM   #110
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Please replace hydraulic cylinders only in pairs, not single ones!

If you replace only one single new or refurbished part, there might be an oblique movement in the roof shell, that should be avoided and potentially can destroy the roof.

The solenoid replacement seems to be very curious from my point of view. There is no exact 1:1 relationship between these solenoids to a roof module!


Opening while driving slow(!) is not an issue even with the models before spring 2012. Your issue came up though you didn't use this option.

Last edited by RobbiZ4; 06-26-2020 at 04:05 AM..
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