New 2009 2010 BMW Z4 - ZPOST
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   New 2009 2010 BMW Z4 - ZPOST > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General BMW News and Cars Discussion

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      11-29-2023, 08:49 AM   #23
LDT
Major
LDT's Avatar
1610
Rep
1,215
Posts

Drives: 2024 X5 M60i
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Southeast USA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ///MPhatic View Post
When people can't be prudent then prudence should be forced upon them. The question is; can we leave it at prudence when that genie is out of his bottle?

The 0-60/ľ-mile/top speed parts are safe, they have to do with freedom, and it's one one thing we won't ever give up. That's why you have 47M licensed drivers that can't pass a driving test.

And yes, I'm one of those that think to get a license you should have to take an ANNUAL written test, driving test, vision/hearing/spatial-awareness test, and drug test before you PAY for your license.

May it one day be so.
Agree with getting unlicensed, uninsured and incompetent drivers off the roadway, especially illegals. And if couples had to pass a test before becoming parents weíd have half as many morons driving around.
__________________
2024 X5M60i-- Skyscraper/Ivory
2020 Cayenne replaced by ^^
2017 X5 35d--still in my diesel phase
2015 GL 350--diesel burner/highway queen
2013 Audi S6--a beast in it's day
Appreciate 2
///MPhatic14156.50
      11-29-2023, 09:36 AM   #24
Car-Addicted
Lieutenant Colonel
Car-Addicted's Avatar
United_States
7287
Rep
1,978
Posts

Drives: 2020 BMW M4 CS
Join Date: Jun 2023
Location: Central PA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW M4 CS  [9.88]
I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that the demographics of drunk drivers is not in favor of them being buyers of new cars?
Appreciate 2
LDT1610.00
      11-29-2023, 10:23 AM   #25
Westside Guy
Brigadier General
Westside Guy's Avatar
United_States
5947
Rep
4,577
Posts

Drives: 2022 Z4 M40i, 2021 228i GC
Join Date: Sep 2021
Location: Hallandale Beach, FL

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by labphoto View Post
Could have used it with the moron that did 153 mph and killed two passengers.

https://www.abc15.com/news/crime/dri...two-passengers
FYI, speed has nothing to do with stupidity as a moron could be driving at 40-50 mph and kill people also.
Appreciate 1
cmyx6go15823.00
      11-29-2023, 11:09 AM   #26
KevinGS
Colonel
3379
Rep
2,171
Posts

Drives: Past 2015 M4, Current 2013 M3
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (0)

Emotionally, as a car enthusiast, in a vacuum, I say, "Hell no, of course not."

Logically, as a member of a collective society, "Yes, of course we should limit the speed of cars, especially since states have speed limits anyway." It makes no sense to have speed limits and then allow cars the ability to go above it. Why have a limit in the first place?

Driving is a privilege, not a right. And no where is it written that fun should be a part of driving, especially as it relates to high-speed driving.

As for track cars, I'm sure they could make a technology where the cars can go at higher speeds only in selected locations, like a track.

Hec, with all the noise many cars are making these days (burble, crackle, pop tunes be damned!), I'm shockedthere's not widespread state legislation to rid society of all this noisy mayhem when people are driving, especially in neighborhoods and cities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Westside Guy View Post
FYI, speed has nothing to do with stupidity as a moron could be driving at 40-50 mph and kill people also.
Well, yes, but excess speed exacerbates the issue.
Appreciate 0
      11-29-2023, 12:42 PM   #27
F32Fleet
Lieutenant General
F32Fleet's Avatar
United_States
3634
Rep
10,394
Posts

Drives: 2015 435i
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Southeastern US

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Car-Addicted View Post
That's cold but in general we are doing pretty well on lowering the motor vehicle fatality rate.

The number is so ridiculously low but dragonslayers must find dragons to slay in order to justify their existence.
__________________
"Drive more, worry less. "

435i, MPPK, MPE, M-Sport Line
Appreciate 1
      11-29-2023, 02:04 PM   #28
erickonphoenix
Lieutenant
erickonphoenix's Avatar
1739
Rep
538
Posts

Drives: 2014 Gray 328xi Touring
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Houston TX

iTrader: (0)

I won't condone speeding on any public roads but if I did I'd suggest maybe NOT doing it on surface streets with cross traffic?

When I was young and dumb we kept that stuff way out in the middle of nowhere so we wouldn't crash into people and there were fewer cops.
__________________
Appreciate 1
///MPhatic14156.50
      11-29-2023, 02:30 PM   #29
YASBBYM3
Major
YASBBYM3's Avatar
United_States
595
Rep
1,117
Posts

Drives: BMW M4 Cs Lamborghini Huracan
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Florida

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by F32Fleet View Post
The number is so ridiculously low but dragonslayers must find dragons to slay in order to justify their existence.
Well, if you want to be 100% correct, you donít stop the chart at 2010 as the number has risen pretty consistently since then and stands at 1.35 as of 2022. But thatís only if accuracy is important.
Appreciate 0
      11-29-2023, 02:36 PM   #30
tracer bullet
Brigadier General
tracer bullet's Avatar
United_States
2539
Rep
3,644
Posts

Drives: '11 135i , '15 X3 35i
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Saint Paul, MN

iTrader: (1)

If there was a limit such as 155 mph, I'd find it hard to argue. If the limit was 70, I certainly would. Changing it depending on where you are at any given moment is feasible but doesn't seem realistic anytime soon. And when it is, the cars will be driving themselves anyhow.

Even at 155 I understand the slippery slope thing.
Appreciate 0
      11-29-2023, 03:02 PM   #31
rak299
Major
United_States
602
Rep
1,050
Posts

Drives: 2021 M3 6MT
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: san francisco

iTrader: (0)

A great idea, if coupled with a driver ejector seal and a large explosive device, so the car will not block other traffic.
Appreciate 0
      11-29-2023, 03:20 PM   #32
KevinGS
Colonel
3379
Rep
2,171
Posts

Drives: Past 2015 M4, Current 2013 M3
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Car-Addicted View Post
That's cold but in general we are doing pretty well on lowering the motor vehicle fatality rate.
We're doing pretty well, huh?

On average, there are over 6 million passenger car accidents in the U.S. every year. Road crashes are the leading cause of death in the country, resulting in more than 38,000 people losing their lives each year.

According to the DOT, 42,939 people died on America’s roads in 2021. Compared to 2020, fatalities increased:
  • 10.1% overall. 42,939 lives were lost, the highest total number recorded since 2005
  • 14% on urban roads
  • 14% among drivers ages 65 and older
  • 12.5% among people walking, totaling 7,388 lives lost, the highest recorded in decades
  • 17% among fatal crashes involving at least one large truck
  • 8% among motorcyclists, totaling 5,932 lives lost, the highest total ever recorded



Appreciate 1
co_440i118.50
      11-29-2023, 03:48 PM   #33
FC4
Brigadier General
2741
Rep
3,442
Posts

Drives: Yes
Join Date: May 2014
Location: US

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by YASBBYM3 View Post
Should cars have built-in speed limits?
No.
Appreciate 2
cmyx6go15823.00
      11-29-2023, 05:42 PM   #34
Car-Addicted
Lieutenant Colonel
Car-Addicted's Avatar
United_States
7287
Rep
1,978
Posts

Drives: 2020 BMW M4 CS
Join Date: Jun 2023
Location: Central PA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW M4 CS  [9.88]
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinGS View Post
We're doing pretty well, huh?
According to the DOT, 42,939 people died on Americaís roads in 2021.
For prospective, not even making the list.
Top 10 leading causes of death in the US, 2021
Heart Disease 695,547
Cancer 605,213
COVID-19 416,893
Accidents (unintentional injuries) 224,935
Stroke 162,890
Chronic lower respiratory diseases 142,342
Alzheimer's disease 119,399
Diabetes 103,294
Chronic liver disease and cirrhosis 56,585
Kidney disease 54,358
Appreciate 3
      11-29-2023, 05:48 PM   #35
NickyC
Lieutenant General
NickyC's Avatar
17678
Rep
10,732
Posts

Drives: M4 CS. Former G82, x2 F82, F80
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Jacked out of my mind

iTrader: (23)

Ban assault cars!
Appreciate 1
cmyx6go15823.00
      11-29-2023, 05:54 PM   #36
Car-Addicted
Lieutenant Colonel
Car-Addicted's Avatar
United_States
7287
Rep
1,978
Posts

Drives: 2020 BMW M4 CS
Join Date: Jun 2023
Location: Central PA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW M4 CS  [9.88]
Quote:
Originally Posted by NickyC View Post
Ban assault cars!
You and I own "assault cars".
Appreciate 4
      11-29-2023, 06:12 PM   #37
FC4
Brigadier General
2741
Rep
3,442
Posts

Drives: Yes
Join Date: May 2014
Location: US

iTrader: (0)

For those in favor of limiting speed, why stop there? Why not limit acceleration rate as well?
Appreciate 1
      11-29-2023, 07:05 PM   #38
KevinGS
Colonel
3379
Rep
2,171
Posts

Drives: Past 2015 M4, Current 2013 M3
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Car-Addicted View Post
For prospective, not even making the list.
Top 10 leading causes of death in the US, 2021
Heart Disease 695,547
Cancer 605,213
COVID-19 416,893
Accidents (unintentional injuries) 224,935
Stroke 162,890
Chronic lower respiratory diseases 142,342
Alzheimer's disease 119,399
Diabetes 103,294
Chronic liver disease and cirrhosis 56,585
Kidney disease 54,358
Oh, so because traffic accidents miss the Top 10 by like 12,000 people (so like four 9-11s), annually, it's a non-issue, not even worthy of proposing solutions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FC4 View Post
For those in favor of limiting speed, why stop there? Why not limit acceleration rate as well?
Yeah, why not? Do road cars (and motorcycles) really need to accelerate at a ridiculously high rate?

Appreciate 0
      11-29-2023, 07:23 PM   #39
Car-Addicted
Lieutenant Colonel
Car-Addicted's Avatar
United_States
7287
Rep
1,978
Posts

Drives: 2020 BMW M4 CS
Join Date: Jun 2023
Location: Central PA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW M4 CS  [9.88]
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinGS View Post
Oh, so because traffic accidents miss the Top 10 by like 12,000 people (so like four 9-11s), annually, it's a non-issue, not even worthy of proposing solutions
Never said that lives are not important but there is a cause and effect issue here.
These measures will raise the cost of new cars and as a percent of cars on the road, new cars will be a very small percentage thus almost no change in traffic deaths saved by this law.
If we are playing a numbers game since most fatal deaths occur in drivers from age 25 - 34yr should we have greater restrictions on that group?
Point is this is a slippery slope and more about emotion and less about laws that can make a change, like enforcement of laws already on the books relating to speeding, DWI and property damage.

Curious how many folks who think this is a good idea to save lives are also supportive of abortion rights?
Appreciate 2
      11-29-2023, 07:42 PM   #40
Suds
/M Enthusiast
Suds's Avatar
United_States
1606
Rep
1,619
Posts

Drives: Responsiblish
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Lone Star State

iTrader: (1)

All I can say is i will need 3-5 seconds of push to pass on back roads, unlimited speed.
This would be a driving experience I haven’t had since driving governed gas go-carts when I was a kid. We know that work around.

Also, don’t let your insurance company stick their dongle into your OBD port.
__________________
2019 M2 Comp, Alpine White, DCT, track car build, 1/2 cage, AP Racing Brakes & Nitron Coilovers, BM3 Stage 1 93 Oct.
2018 Porsche Cayman GTS, Night Blue Metalic, PDK, COBB tuned 93 Oct.
2004 Audi A4 Avant USP 6mt, RS4 clutch, built motor, Garrett GT3071r "Big Ass Turbo" Motoza Tune
Appreciate 2
chris7197386.00
      11-29-2023, 07:52 PM   #41
chris719
Major General
7386
Rep
7,340
Posts

Drives: '08 M Roadster
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: NJ

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Car-Addicted View Post
Curious how many folks who think this is a good idea to save lives are also supportive of abortion rights?
I'm not in favor of speed limits, but this is an absolutely ludicrous comparison to make.
Appreciate 0
      11-29-2023, 07:57 PM   #42
chris719
Major General
7386
Rep
7,340
Posts

Drives: '08 M Roadster
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: NJ

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by eugenebmw View Post
Any EV cars definitely need to have build in speed limits. Even low end EV cars can easy reach over 300 hp. Not to mention high end EV are over 600 hp. If you hit by a EV (easy to be over 1 ton), good luck
This is not a good take. Most EVs lose power at high rpm and have poorer high speed capability. I've never even seen an EV going over 90 MPH and rarely see them go over 70-75. Every big triple digit disaster I've ever heard of was caused by an ICE car.

I do think this is a consequence of the overall horsepower wars though. A 13 second quarter mile was a fast car 20 years ago. Now everything is fast and the truly fast cars are ridiculous.
Appreciate 0
      11-29-2023, 08:00 PM   #43
KevinGS
Colonel
3379
Rep
2,171
Posts

Drives: Past 2015 M4, Current 2013 M3
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Car-Addicted View Post
Never said that lives are not important but there is a cause and effect issue here.
These measures will raise the cost of new cars and as a percent of cars on the road...
...so did 3-point seatbelts, front headrests, airbags, 3rd brake lights, ABS, backup cameras, and bigger bumpers. And I'm sure when each of these safety advances was proposed, consumers and auto manufacturers made the same argument: "It will raise the cost of a new car and that's unfair to consumers." Saving lives be damned, cheaper products is what really matters.

Quote:
new cars will be a very small percentage thus almost no change in traffic deaths saved by this law.
Oh, so if the proposed measure won't save a significant amount of lives (as a percentage) in Year 1, it's not effective enough and we shouldn't consider it?

Quote:
If we are playing a numbers game since most fatal deaths occur in drivers from age 25 - 34yr should we have greater restrictions on that group?
Why not? Insurance costs are higher for younger drivers, which young people (and/or their parents) often argue is "not fair". And many states restrict what time of the day new drivers can drive, and some even restrict who can be in the car.

So if we collectively think restrictions on when someone can drive is a prudent thing to do to save lives, why then allow the 17-year-old to purchase a $15,000 used V8 that we allow them to modify to 500hp+, and then bitch and moan when that person is speeding, or worse, kills someone in an accident?

Maybe the adults in the room should look ourselves in the mirror first.

Quote:
Point is this is a slippery slope and more about emotion and less about laws
Oh, that's an interesting perspective. When we look at the figures and deem that 40,000 car accident deaths is simply way too many lives lost since many of these are likely preventable with technology, that's considered being too emotional.

But when car enthusiasts suggest that they want to be able to drive as fast as they want and accelerate as fast as they want on public roads (within reason, of course ), purely for entertainment purposes, that's rational.

And yes, every law or legislation is a slippery slope. If this were the reason why we shouldn't enact new legislation, then nothing new would ever pass. And I'm sure this "slippery slope" argument has been used since the first day any government was established, and still used today (with great success, by the way).

Quote:
...that can make a change, like enforcement of laws already on the books relating to speeding, DWI and property damage.
So, across the country, let's continue to use our precious police resources every day to catch people speeding and driving drunk when we could simply have the auto manufacturers fix much of this with technologies that already exist?

What a prudent use of our tax dollars.
Appreciate 2
      11-29-2023, 08:05 PM   #44
chris719
Major General
7386
Rep
7,340
Posts

Drives: '08 M Roadster
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: NJ

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinGS View Post
So, across the country, let's continue to use our precious police resources every day to catch people speeding and driving drunk when we could simply have the auto manufacturers fix much of this with technologies that already exist?

What a prudent use of our tax dollars.
Don't worry, this will never happen because of what you highlighted here. The police and municipalities will never allow their speeding ticket revenue stream to go away.
Appreciate 1
KevinGS3378.50
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:45 PM.




zpost
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST