Intermittent boot open message on idrive.

[KennyP]

OK.
Recently i have been getting intermittent boot open messages while driving.
It mostly happens on bumpy roads, going over bigger bumps or while turning hard on a curvy road. Mostly i have gotten this message with the top down.

Message comes, shows and goes away again. And its not happening every time i drive. Like i did a trip to the shops from our summer house that is around 20km of curvy country roads. While going to the shop i got boot open messages popping up numerous times. At the shop i put the roof up, loaded all the shopping in and dropped the roof again. Now i drove the same curvy country road back and this time no warnings at all. Of course i wasnt driving slowly and was having all my fun on that road.

Loud bassy music can cause boot open message aswell. When message poppes up i turn the music down and it goes away and wont come back.

When i stop and check the boot it is closed and fine.

Its been happening now numerous times, so its time to start looking for what is causing this...

Worn out latch? Latch needs adjustment? Some sensor somewhere? Broken wires?

First thing i will try is to put a battery tender on, I know with old battery when it was getting low it wanted to pop the trunk sometimes aswell. But that came together with battery discharge messages and after charging or driving longer went away. Also it usually happened in the parking lot, not while driving 120km/h for example. Battery has been replaced 1.5 years ago and should be fine.

Anybody had similar issue? and fixed it? Ideas?

[Marcoose]

Maybe the guy in the boot isn't dead yet?

[RobbiZ4]

Hi Kenny,

in most cases the microswitch coupling lock are responsible for these issues.
Part No
54377228585
54377228586

plus 4x new screws M3x5mm

My recommendations in the German ZRoadster forum:
https://translate.google.com/transla...ions.133084%2F

Mark the position of the 3 nuts on each coupling lock with a white edding marker before dismounting!! Then drill out the old screws and replace the switches with the new screws.

No adjustment or coding is required.

In addition, renew both salmon relais at the hydraulic pump (part no 2x 12631742690) => recommendation #1

[KennyP]

Originally Posted by RobbiZ4

Hi Kenny,

in most cases the microswitch coupling lock are responsible for these issues.
Part No
54377228585
54377228586

plus 4x new screws M3x5mm

My recommendations in the German ZRoadster forum:
https://translate.google.com/transla...ions.133084%2F

Mark the position of the 3 nuts on each coupling lock with a white edding marker before dismounting!! Then drill out the old screws and replace the switches with the new screws.

No adjustment or coding is required.

In addition, renew both salmon relais at the hydraulic pump (part no 2x 12631742690) => recommendation #1

Thanks RobbiZ4!
Will take a look at kinematics box first to see the scope of the work needed to be done.
Instructions link on zroadster thread did not work for me, but found instructions on newtis myself.
"Replace microswitch on the left/right Kinematics box" should be correct?
PDF of the left one is attached.

Also when reading instructions:

Note:
Hydraulic system must be at zero pressure.

Unscrew screw on hydraulic unit by 1.5 turns.

Any insights, tips on that?

Great recommendations thread on zroadster. Very helpful.
I was aware of salmon relays and that they should be replaced. Havent done that yet... dont really know why... lazyness i guess. Looks like a great opportunity to get that done aswell. Thanks for the reminder on that!

[RobbiZ4]

Open the roof until the boot lid is vertical, then stop.

NewTis instruction is ok.
You need sth. like a broom stick to support the boot lid, when openening the rear brass valve (these are valves, not screws!!).


Following the above translated link to ZRoadster, you'll find the background story about destroyed hydraulic pumps sourced by welded relay contacts.
Don't hesitate a single day to get it replaced!
And have a look at my 10-seconds-replacement instruction.

[KennyP]

Originally Posted by RobbiZ4

Open the roof until the boot lid is vertical, then stop.

NewTis instruction is ok.
You need sth. like a broom stick to support the boot lid, when openening the rear brass valve (these are valves, not screws!!).


Following the above translated link to ZRoadster, you'll find the background story about destroyed hydraulic pumps sourced by welded relay contacts.
Don't hesitate a single day to get it replaced!
And have a look at my 10-seconds-replacement instruction.

Awesome!
Valves do make alot more sense.
Do i have to screw it back later (to close?) after reassembly? Instructutions only say to turn 1.5 turns and thats it? No need to do anything else?

I purchased both switches and salmon relays from leebmann24.de so now im waiting for parts to arrive.

Big thanks for all the information. Its much appreciated.

[RobbiZ4]

Correct.
1.5 to a max of about 2 turns to open a shortcut inside of the hydraulic unit, and the same turns back to close the rear valve. As both brass "screws" are locked, you will "feel" the end of the possible turns.
Imortant: no violence, just open and close the valve.

Nothing else is required to release the pressure in the hydraulic hoses.

[RobbiZ4]

Hi Kenny,
Where are you from, Finland or Lithuania?
In the following my recommendations in both languages.


Lithuania:
https://www-zroadster-com.translate....o=ajax,nv,elem

Finland:
https://www-zroadster-com.translate....o=ajax,nv,elem

[RobbiZ4]

Similiar story:
https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic...54658#p1854658

[KennyP]

Originally Posted by RobbiZ4

Hi Kenny,
Where are you from, Finland or Lithuania?
In the following my recommendations in both languages.


Lithuania:
https://www-zroadster-com.translate....o=ajax,nv,elem

Finland:
https://www-zroadster-com.translate....o=ajax,nv,elem

Im from Estonia (Estland in german)that is basically between the two. Its a small country south of Finland 80km over the gulf. Though i have once lived in Finland for 5 years aswell.
Most northern country of the 3 Baltic states. Lithuania is most southern of the 3.

I did make user account on zroadser to get access to some content there that needed it and i am translating it to english using Chrome plugin. So i can read all the content with no issues.

[RobbiZ4]

Perfect! What's your new nick?


Ok got it.


You have to update the security options in the new profile:
- allow members to have a view at your profile
- allow members to get in contact with you by personal messages
- activate email notification on messages and responses

[RobbiZ4]

Estonian:
https://www-zroadster-com.translate....o=ajax,nv,elem

[surfwooder]

Originally Posted by RobbiZ4

Open the roof until the boot lid is vertical, then stop.

NewTis instruction is ok.
You need sth. like a broom stick to support the boot lid, when openening the rear brass valve (these are valves, not screws!!).


Following the above translated link to ZRoadster, you'll find the background story about destroyed hydraulic pumps sourced by welded relay contacts.
Don't hesitate a single day to get it replaced!
And have a look at my 10-seconds-replacement instruction.

I've been reading this thread. I feel the part about "welded relay contacts" tells a compelling story about the condition of the hydraulic pump/motor assembly. When the electric motor possibly shorted, it caused high current draw through the contacts of the salmon relays. The contact having a resistance at the contact point caused excessive heat, hence welding of the contacts. Power to these contacts come directly from the Battery Power Distribution Box, mounted on the bulkhead to the right of the battery in the trunk. Both salmon relays are controlled by the CTM by a 12v signal to the relays actuation coil, which will make the contact for the high amperage drive power for the motor. When the contacts in the relay became welded, full battery amperage was applied to the motor. This high amperage would seek to complete the circuit through the grounded motor, and fry the motor. Remove the salmon relays to break the shorted circuit, or a fire may occur. If you doubt this scenario remove the conductor (wire) from the BPDB, and place a amp meter in line and read the amps pulled by the motor in circuit. during this test replace the original salmon relay. Hopefully this will help diagnose the problem.

[KennyP]

Parts arrived today.
Did go ahead and replaced my salmon relays right away.

Noticed that my old relays had 34A marking on it and new relays had 61A marking on them. Thats considerably higher amp rating, almost double, if these markings even are for amps.

Checked bmwfans.info to see if these relays had been updated at some point but it did not show any old partnumbers... always the same partnumber ending with 690 as it should.

Dont know if there is any difference in reliability, but thought its worth mentioning. Roof operates just fine.

EDIT: Its not amps. Its production data. Disregard previous section about amp ratings.

And my relays had been replaced once before... old ones were dated 2011/30... so they were changed 3 years after cars production date. Still... this was 10 years ago... but hey now they are replaced and thankfully old relays had not failed me.

Will tackle microswitches soon. Have to get some stuff first: white marker, some tools and new screws for the switches.

[RobbiZ4]

Originally Posted by surfwooder

This high amperage would seek to complete the circuit through the grounded motor, and fry the motor.

That's not quite correct, there won't be an initial short.

The motor takes up to 40 amperes, when turning left or right.
Not the current destroys the motor, it gets overheated after about 5-10 minutes of continous run, when the relay contact got welded.
All plastic parts inside of the rotating e-motor begin to melt and it destroys it self while still rotating. Then it blocks completely and a copper wire of the anchor will melt as well.

[RobbiZ4]

Originally Posted by KennyP

Noticed that my old relays had 34A marking on it and new relays had 61A marking on them. Thats considerably higher amp rating, almost double, if these markings even are for amps.

Pardon that's nonsense. It (xxA) is only a production info, no amperage !!

Originally Posted by KennyP

Will tackle microswitches soon. Have to get some stuff first: white marker, some tools and new screws for the switches.

[KennyP]

Originally Posted by RobbiZ4

Pardon that's nonsense. It (xxA) is only a production info, no amperage !!

Thought so. Did not make sense to be amps really. Then again relays, contactors or any switch for that matter usually has amp rating marked on them. Wierd way to mark production information and confuse people...

[RobbiZ4]

Originally Posted by KennyP

Thought so. Did not make sense to be amps really. Then again relays, contactors or any switch for that matter usually has amp rating marked on them. Wierd way to mark production information and confuse people...

Well, that might be correct for an aftermarket product.


But in this case, the exact specification is a BMW internal one. Only the exact part number ist sth., the customer has to know.

[KennyP]

Have not gotten around to replacing microswitches in kinematics boxes yet.

Noticed new symptoms that are happening.
Been driving in the city for the past week or so and during that time i havent had any boot open warnings any more. Not bumpy enough i guess...
BUT...

About half the time i drop the roof, after the rear glass has folded on top of roof and trunk lid opens backwards to recieve the roof package, about when trunklid is half way vertical or almost vertical i hear trunk lid softclose operating and pulling trunklid to close. Same softclose sound when softclose is pulling the trunk shut when you close trunk normally..

Can this also be caused by the microswitches at the kinematics box?

I have started to think that issue is maybe in the trunk lid itself. Read on some other forum where multiple owners had wires break in the trunklid near some sort of connector and that caused softclose to go nuts or not work at all.

thread i read:
https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=91766
Any thoughts?

[RobbiZ4]

Originally Posted by KennyP

[...]I have started to think that issue is maybe in the trunk lid itself. Read on some other forum where multiple owners had wires break in the trunklid near some sort of connector and that caused softclose to go nuts or not work at all.

thread i read:
https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=91766
Any thoughts?

This is correct.
1-3 Wires will break most times on the left.

[KennyP]

And this actually was the cause of my problem... Wires are broken exactly at that spot. Now have to solder these 3 wires back together, heatshrink and reassemble.

By the way today my softclose finally did go completely nuts, actuating nonstop in a loop for a while. This confirmed my suspicions and took things apart right away.