Z4 dct disapoint CAR and DRIVER

[az34]

in the february issue of car and driver a z4 whit dct get a devastating bad review in their anually lightning lap road test and all the critics blame the dct i've never been a fan of dct,nothing can replace a real manual trans. and i know what i'm talking about my dd is an A3 whit dct (my wife dont drive MT) after a while it gets boring and you let it in drive as for any auto trans.

[35iDriver]

Ok, so the scorecard is now as follows:

1 bad review for the DCT
55 good or stellar reviews for the DCT

Ferrari offers only the DCT (and no manual) in a couple of their models.
'Nuff said

[az34]

Originally Posted by 35iDriver

Ok, so the scorecard is now as follows:

1 bad review for the DCT
55 good or stellar reviews for the DCT

Ferrari offers only the DCT (and no manual) in a couple of their models.
'Nuff said

yes but ferrari dct are lightyears ahead from bmw's unit.

[bjarne]

Originally Posted by az34

yes but ferrari dct are lightyears ahead from bmw's unit.

And what do you base that statement on ?

[tranquility]

I don't mind retrogrouches preferring the MT for the 'feel' or whatever, but in terms of performance, DCT>MT any time of the day. I'm all for progress and technology.

[az34]

Originally Posted by bjarne

And what do you base that statement on ?

dct had been engenireed,pioneered,develloped,in the early 90's by ferrari for their F1 car and others manufaturers version are pale copies.

[jparnes1]

I'm getting a new Z4 next month through a buy back with BMW. This time around I'm getting a 6MT. Why? Because I'm planning to keep this car for a very long time. The problems I had that led to the buy back have jaded me a little to the high tech nature of the car. I figure anything that I can do to decrease the high degree of technology will pay off down the road. Don't get me wrong, I love the way this car performs, computers and all. But I don't mind using a MT and the chances of something going wrong with it are much, much less than with the DCT. Which means the chances of me having to spend $8000 for a new tranny is less.

[bjarne]

Originally Posted by az34

dct had been engenireed,pioneered,develloped,in the early 90's by ferrari for their F1 car and others manufaturers version are pale copies.

Do you have anything to back up that opinion ?
I am not saying you are wrong, but so far I just see it as your opinion.

[rmorin49]

Type of tranny is a personal choice. For me, there was no question, I wanted a traditional roadster with a manual tranny. The DCT is a good compromise if you want the ability to play with the gears but for me there is nothing like a traditional manual tranny. They have also proven to be much more reliable than any automatic BMW has ever sold.

[09cbb]

Originally Posted by az34

dct had been engenireed,pioneered,develloped,in the early 90's by ferrari for their F1 car and others manufaturers version are pale copies.

This type of transmission was invented by Frenchman Adolphe Kégresse just prior to World War II. The first actual DCTs arrived from Porsche in-house development, for Audi and Porsche racing cars in the 1980s.

[DavidJS]

According to the Wikipedia article on dual clutch transmissions, Ferrari uses DCTs from Getrag and Graziano. Doesn't sound like they are produced or developed in house. Is Wiki wrong on that? I know the BMW unit is a Getrag.

[teagueAMX]

Originally Posted by DavidJS

According to the Wikipedia article on dual clutch transmissions, Ferrari uses DCTs from Getrag and Graziano. Doesn't sound like they are produced or developed in house. Is Wiki wrong on that? I know the BMW unit is a Getrag.

You are correct.

Virtually all DCTs are the same basic design with tweaks by indiviual manufactures. Neither Bugatti nor Maclaren make their own, either. Not a difference, but more of a style is that some are coupled to the engine, some are trans-axles. The other single variation is either a wet or dry clutch. Horsepower and torque are major considerations whereas a traditional "automatic" can handle massive amounts of torque because of the torque converter, the DCTs clutch is very direct, just like a true manual dry clutch transmission.

[SANguru]

Originally Posted by az34

dct had been engenireed,pioneered,develloped,in the early 90's by ferrari for their F1 car and others manufaturers version are pale copies.

huh?? that's false. Ferrari uses the same basic tranny manufactured and designed by getrag.

[az34]

thanks to all of you who took the time to search i have to apologize Ferrari did'nt invented dct but i know for sure thei have been the first to used it on a street car (1997 f355f1) but that was'nt the subject of my topic the tread was about all the negative comment C AND D made about their dctz4.

[DavidJS]

I'm not a subscriber to C&D, and could find nothing on their website about the BMW DCT. Can someone summarize their comments?

[35iDriver]

Originally Posted by az34

yes but ferrari dct are lightyears ahead from bmw's unit.

No they are not lighyears ahead. There are absolutely no facts to prove that. That is a flat out lie.

[az34]

Originally Posted by DavidJS

I'm not a subscriber to C&D, and could find nothing on their website about the BMW DCT. Can someone summarize their comments?

go on a newspaper stall and get the mags.its the february issue whit the new 911 on the cover.

[Mr. ///M3 RD]

Originally Posted by DavidJS

I'm not a subscriber to C&D, and could find nothing on their website about the BMW DCT. Can someone summarize their comments?

This as far as I know is a fairly old story ... and much discussed in the past. In the end it's all a matter of preference and need as to what type of transmission one gets. I think the C&D story dates back to 2008

Here is a link ===> CLICK

EDIT UPDATE ===> Please disregard the 2008 link, it seams we are talking about a February issue article by C&D.

[az34]

Originally Posted by 35iDriver

No they are not lighyears ahead. There are absolutely no facts to prove that. That is a flat out lie.

read number 14 of the tread.

[35iDriver]

Originally Posted by az34

in the february issue of car and driver a z4 whit dct get a devastating bad review in their anually lightning lap road test and all the critics blame the dct i've never been a fan of dct,nothing can replace a real manual trans. and i know what i'm talking about my dd is an A3 whit dct (my wife dont drive MT) after a while it gets boring and you let it in drive as for any auto trans.

It's ironic that you say "nothing can replace a manual," when it is the DCT itself that has fast been relacing it for the past few years.
If the DCT transmission wasn't popular and didn't perfom the way it does, it would have fallen by the wayside long ago.

I'm struggling to figure out what purpose or value your initial post serves, other than for you to force your personal opinion on us.

There are several other stellar reviews on the DCT, so those counter every argument you've tried to make. There is no need and nothing for anyone to gain by focusing on this one article you reference. The article proves absolutely nothing.

[az34]

Originally Posted by 35iDriver

It's ironic that you say "nothing can replace a manual," when it is the DCT itself that has fast been relacing it for the past few years.
If the DCT transmission wasn't popular and didn't perfom the way it does, it would have fallen by the wayside long ago.

You are trying to force your personal opinion too far.

not at all dont take it personal,i dont know if you have read the mag if not please do it personnaly i have nothing against dct (i have an audi whit dct) all i want is some feedbacks from owners of z4dct particularly those who have read the mag. in the meantime have a nice day!

[HerrK]

Originally Posted by DavidJS

I'm not a subscriber to C&D, and could find nothing on their website about the BMW DCT. Can someone summarize their comments?

Basically it alluded to the problem with not being able to hold a gear even in the manual mode thus not being in the proper gear for the next corner/segment of the track. Also some inconsistent up and down shifts in the the auto mode. Of course this is all on the track with experienced drivers. The Z4 35is DCT times were off about 4 sec from the 1M with a manual and basically the same engine (OK so it does have a locking diff, M3 brakes and suspension). Sorry all you DCT lovers!