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08-19-2011, 12:51 PM | #23 |
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It's definitely a matter of personal opinion...but now I have an even better performing choice that gets great gas mileage too. This means that I'll still be saving $$ each year as opposed to what I would be paying in gas for the 35i (...and possibly saving more in speeding tickets too). lol
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08-19-2011, 01:36 PM | #26 |
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08-19-2011, 01:40 PM | #27 |
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08-19-2011, 01:51 PM | #28 | |
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I definitely would have made the same choice today as I did 2 years ago and gone with the Turbo 6 over the Turbo 4. For me, the additional gas mileage isn't anywhere close to the benefit of the additional power and torque the Turbo 6 has over the Turbo 4. Last edited by BlueZ4AZ; 08-21-2011 at 08:58 AM.. |
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08-19-2011, 02:13 PM | #29 | |
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The Miata handles incredibly well and has great gas mileage (although the 28i will have better mpg than the Miata), but I want a tad more power, comfort, and luxury too. Don't get me wrong, I would choose the 35i or a Porsche over the 28i if money wasn't an issue, but times a little tighter than I care for...at least it's not too tight where a Miata (or nothing) is my only option. Anyway, I know I'm not the only one in this situation, otherwise auto makers wouldn't have bothered downsizing their engines like they are starting to do. To each his own... |
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08-19-2011, 02:16 PM | #30 | |
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08-19-2011, 02:21 PM | #31 |
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The N20 definitely looks to be an improvement over the aging but reliable N52. I'm looking forward to seeing this in BMW's lineup.
Yeah I saw the $50k sticker, for that price I'd want more. It's one of the reasons I didn't even consider an Audi when shopping for cars ...
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08-19-2011, 02:48 PM | #32 |
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08-19-2011, 05:56 PM | #33 |
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08-19-2011, 09:57 PM | #35 |
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$50k for a 4cyl powered car? I just don't know if Americans will buy it. I'm sure it will do fine in other markets though...
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08-20-2011, 02:45 PM | #36 |
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Considering most 1-series owners think that their cars are FWD, I don't think that this will be a slouch in the sales dept. Actually, I think it will do better than the outgoing engine for two reasons. First reason, better gas milage. Second reason, more power. Sure, there will be, and are, people that think the way you do. But as a whole most people are just badge whores so this probably won't bother them.
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08-20-2011, 02:55 PM | #37 |
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Hey, we'll always have hope right?
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08-20-2011, 05:06 PM | #38 |
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I have a lot of experience with turbo-four engines, and my honest opinion is that they are a fool's paradise when it comes down to these two factors.
None of the turbo-fours I have owned over the years have delivered anywhere near their rated MPG in real-world driving, especially under spirited driving. The "throttle tax" is much worse than on larger displacement normally aspirated engines. If you baby them, you can get good MPG. But if driven hard, or driven over a lot of city routes, forget it. As far as power goes, I own and have owned turbo-four engines that are more powerful than the normally-aspirated straight-six in my Z4. But I would never trade engines with any of those cars. To me, there is a coarseness and lack of refinement in a turbo-four, and it's about 180 degrees from the perfectly balanced and wonderfully smooth straight-six. Part of what drew me to the Z4 was the legendary BMW straight-six, which has been a nice change of pace from the fours and turbo-fours in my recent sports cars. And that helped justify the price. I probably wouldn't have even looked at the Z4 if it came equipped with a turbo-four. It just wouldn't have been as compelling to me since I have owned turbo-four engines in much cheaper sports cars. Now, as an example, consider my current SUV, a 2007 Acura RDX. It has a turbo-four rated at 240 HP and 260 ft-lb torque. It's a beast of an engine in terms of power, and based on some recent test drives, it feels a heck of a lot more powerful than the straight-six in the 2011 X3 28i (to be honest, I feel like it gives the 35i a run for the money). But the refinement sucks compared to the X3's engine. In addition to the inherent dynamic characteristics of the inline four cylinder, it's a bit thrashy, the turbo makes the usual cacophony of pumping and whining noises, and the blow-off valve adds an occasional whoosh. It's just not there in terms of refinement. In terms of mileage, the RDX is rated 22mpg highway, but I can rarely exceed 19mpg on my commute, which is biased to highway driving at 65-75 mph. I drove the X3 28i on the same route, and it got 26mpg, 1mpg better than the window sticker (and on a green car off the lot no less). It confirmed my experience that I can get better mpg with a larger displacement normally aspirated engine that lopes down the highway compared to a frenetic turbo-four that is working fairly hard under the same conditions. It will be interesting to see if BMW's turbo-four lives up to it's mpg ratings in real-world driving. I don't expect it to, but am open to be proven wrong. As far as refinement goes, however, this is another case where I just wouldn't pay big bucks to get an X3 once it's equipped with the turbo-four. I've been there / done that with turbo-four engines in lower-priced SUVs, and don't see the point of paying the BMW tax for that. Give me the straight-six all the way. |
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08-20-2011, 06:14 PM | #39 |
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Well, I have said this before, and will again: expect BMW to post some nice numbers on the EPA highway cycle where they can "drive" the car on the backside of the throttle with no load on the turbo. Do NOT expect anything remotely close to that for any of us in real world driving. Turbos suck gas in any situation where you want any level of performance so my thought is forget whatever the EPA numbers are, you will not be likely to get much better mileage than with the N52 in "real world" driving. A little, yes, but not 5-6 mpg. I am willing to make a bet.
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08-20-2011, 07:10 PM | #40 | |
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I like turbos. You can chose to thrash them or chose to coddle them for great milage. The two operating modes are mutually exclusive. I had a Mazda 3 MPS before the Z. 2.3 litre direct injection 4. 190kW, 380Nm torque. EVen normal driving with a heavy foot, I used more petrol than I do every day in the 35is, and the Z4 is a lot faster and more powerful. There is no doubt that the weight of the foot is more important in milage claims than anything the standard tests can put forward when it comes to a turbo engine (whether 4, 6, 8, 10, 12 or 16 cylinders). While our motor manufacturers are set ever higher hurdles from government regulations on CO2 emmissions and mileage claims for their fleet sales, we will see the rise of the turbo / supercharged engine in response. Just dont believe the best case mileage numbers as being real world.
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08-20-2011, 08:04 PM | #41 | |
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Here is what I know: There is a ~450hp 6 cylinder motor coming that will be shared across multiple M models. SCOTT has said this much. M3, M4, X3 M, X4 M, have all been mentioned. I think Z4 M has also been mentioned, but I don't remember for sure. Here is what I believe: This motor will indeed be used in an E89 Z4M. |
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08-21-2011, 01:46 AM | #42 |
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Does anyone know what kind of turbo it uses?
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08-21-2011, 09:58 AM | #43 | |
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I was quite close to getting the Audi TTS but they were crazy to charge so much for just a 4 cyl (luckily I drove the Z4 before finalizing anything). I thrashed that Audi on my test drive and it just didn't have enough power/smoothness as my 6 cyl. It felt very weak and the a/c took forever to reach operating levels on a hot day. skier also makes another good point about fuel mileage: a lot of these claimed #s are extremely optimistic for many cars, even including the 6 cyl Z4. Anyway, we're all buying these ranges of cars presumably for sport/luxury factors, not to save some small amount of $...we're not buying Nissan Leafs or Honda Civics here. What's the point of getting a Z4 if one is just going to drive like grandma to optimize fuel mileage? Besides, how much of a gas savings are we talking about even if the 4 vs 6 cyl mileage gap is actually there? As an example, I have a 5 cent gas savings card that I use whenever I fill up, which seems pretty significant, but on a full tank, all I save is a little over $2....whoopy-do. It definitely isn't enough to make me want to have 2 less cyls. |
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