Engine Malfunction ... third time - New 2009 2010 BMW Z4

cuddapah · 03-11-2013, 08:50 AM

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This is the 3rd time my Z4 got this message ... first time dealer replaced Low Pressure Fuel Pump .. second time they couldn't find anything except tests on gas showed 14% ethanol. I always use Shell V-Power for the Z4. After the dealer found 14% ethanol, I started going to another Shell gas station which has huge traffic. Even then Z4 got this message. So I don't think this is anything to do with the gas. One strange thing I noticed is, the indicator turns on when weather goes below 40F and stays on until I take the car to the dealership. Any thoughts ?

rking117 · 03-11-2013, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cuddapah

This is the 3rd time my Z4 got this message ... first time dealer replaced Low Pressure Fuel Pump .. second time they couldn't find anything except tests on gas showed 14% ethanol. I always use Shell V-Power for the Z4. After the dealer found 14% ethanol, I started going to another Shell gas station which has huge traffic. Even then Z4 got this message. So I don't think this is anything to do with the gas. One strange thing I noticed is, the indicator turns on when weather goes below 40F and stays on until I take the car to the dealership. Any thoughts ?

try finding a Ethanol free station and see if it still does that.

cuddapah · 03-11-2013, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rking117

try finding a Ethanol free station and see if it still does that.

I tried .. the only rating available here in Jacksonville, FL is 87 which I was told can't be used in Z4 :-(

nicknaz · 03-11-2013, 11:07 AM

How about going to ~10% ethanol? The speculation on the internet is that the lower the ethanol the better for the fuel pump

cuddapah · 03-11-2013, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nicknaz

How about going to ~10% ethanol? The speculation on the internet is that the lower the ethanol the better for the fuel pump

All gas stations says ~10% ethanol by volume and that is what I am putting in for Z4. There may be a bad sensor .. or something else :-(

nicknaz · 03-11-2013, 04:17 PM

If the gas station sign says 10% ethanol and you had a test result that says 14% ethanol that's a big problem.

Perhaps you should file a complain with the appropriate state authority to have them investigate the gas station and also keep all your receipts for the time and expenses you accrue from this issue.

And as others have said, try a different gas station after the pump is fixed.

morfinx · 03-11-2013, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nicknaz

If the gas station sign says 10% ethanol and you had a test result that says 14% ethanol that's a big problem.

Perhaps you should file a complain with the appropriate state authority to have them investigate the gas station and also keep all your receipts for the time and expenses you accrue from this issue.

And as others have said, try a different gas station after the pump is fixed.

Exactly. Each gas pump should have a sticker with information on who the state inspector is. Contact the inspector with your findings.

cuddapah · 03-11-2013, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morfinx

Exactly. Each gas pump should have a sticker with information on who the state inspector is. Contact the inspector with your findings.

Will do .. Also, I talked with BMW NA Customer Relations about this issue and wanted to speak with a higher authority. They called in a Supervisor. He called the service manager here at the dealership and said since the appointment is on Thursday it is not possible to schedule a BMW Tech visit in such a short time. A foreman from other dealership who they say is very skilled will look into the issue on Thursday. If the issue repeats after this attempt then it is a lemon.

z4z4z4 · 03-12-2013, 02:27 AM

Not all gasoline service station pumps label ethanol content. The ethanol industry considers pump labeling to be discriminatory and lobbied successfully for elimination of Federal pump labeling laws in regards to ethanol content. Today's pumps are labeled as to ethanol content only if state law requires it.

I suggest you perform your own testing so not to be led astray by an errant test at the dealership.
It's so interesting that many many people with tuned N54 engines run 30-50% E85/gasoline blend to make huge power for the cheap octane cost. The in tank pump is swapped eventually for increased life, but occasional tanks of up to 25-42% ethanol has quite a following.

http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17458

cuddapah · 03-14-2013, 03:13 PM

BMW service told me that SIX injectors were ordered. They should be in tomorrow. Hope this fixes the issue.

morfinx · 03-14-2013, 03:16 PM

Hmmm, I've had 3 injectors replaced and I also only use Shell V-Power. Coincidence? Perhaps...

cuddapah · 03-14-2013, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morfinx

Hmmm, I've had 3 injectors replaced and I also only use Shell V-Power. Coincidence? Perhaps...

Your Z4 also got 'Engine Malfunction' indicator on ?

morfinx · 03-14-2013, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cuddapah

Your Z4 also got 'Engine Malfunction' indicator on ?

I can't remember. I think the CEL was on. It happened on the morning of the day I was taking my car in for something else. Car ran really rough, felt like it was misfiring. They replaced HPFP and 3 injectors. I never found out exact what the cause was.

cwotoddgood · 03-14-2013, 04:33 PM

Good afternoon All, hope everyone is well!

Is the 'Engine Malfunction' indicator the same as the 'limp' mode referenced in other posts? I am curious if the recalls on the faulty high-pressure fuel pumps may also be (negatively) affecting the injectors.

Regards,
Todd

nicknaz · 03-14-2013, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cwotoddgood

Good afternoon All, hope everyone is well!

Is the 'Engine Malfunction' indicator the same as the 'limp' mode referenced in other posts? I am curious if the recalls on the faulty high-pressure fuel pumps may also be (negatively) affecting the injectors.

Regards,
Todd

A lot of the other posts about "limp mode" (at least the ones I gripe about

) have to do with overheating the oil or coolant not from fuel injector or fuel pump failure.

The "limp mode" I've experience is when the car has with reduced power and it may not show the "engine malfunction" light

juhap · 03-14-2013, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morfinx

I can't remember. I think the CEL was on. It happened on the morning of the day I was taking my car in for something else. Car ran really rough, felt like it was misfiring. They replaced HPFP and 3 injectors. I never found out exact what the cause was.

Almost the exact same thing with my car except they didn't replace the HPFP. I also feed my baby with V-Power only.

lamboworld · 03-15-2013, 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by z4z4z4

Not all gasoline service station pumps label ethanol content. The ethanol industry considers pump labeling to be discriminatory and lobbied successfully for elimination of Federal pump labeling laws in regards to ethanol content. Today's pumps are labeled as to ethanol content only if state law requires it.

I suggest you perform your own testing so not to be led astray by an errant test at the dealership.
It's so interesting that many many people with tuned N54 engines run 30-50% E85/gasoline blend to make huge power for the cheap octane cost. The in tank pump is swapped eventually for increased life, but occasional tanks of up to 25-42% ethanol has quite a following.

http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17458

I ran 30% to 40% E85 in my 135i all of the time and never had an issue.

Paul S · 03-15-2013, 08:31 AM

We use a different octane rating in the UK but while the BMW sales brochure says to use 98 (like Shell V-power), both the handbook and the sticker on the inside of the petrol flap say 95 (regular). On querying this with the dealer it was suggested that using 95 with a fill of 98/99 once very 1000 miles or so would be the way to go. Presumably to get the benfit of the extra additives in the 98 octane every now and again to help with cleaning?

ManiacGT · 03-15-2013, 08:39 AM

I use RON 98 or higher (tesco 99 for example) unless I absolutely cannot find a station with it and then I'll use 95. For the extra few quid, its not worth arguing about.

nicknaz · 03-15-2013, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul S

We use a different octane rating in the UK but while the BMW sales brochure says to use 98 (like Shell V-power), both the handbook and the sticker on the inside of the petrol flap say 95 (regular).

Might be the difference between required (brochure) and recommended (gas tank flap) ratings.

cuddapah · 03-15-2013, 11:11 AM

Latest on this issue ..
Dealer called and told me that while they are putting injectors they found transmission leak and are working on it now. How can they not find this during diagnosis ?

R1robot · 03-15-2013, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lamboworld

I ran 30% to 40% E85 in my 135i all of the time and never had an issue.

after reading that thread, I still find it hard to believe you can use E85 on an engine that is supposed to be "fuel-flex". And why use only 40%? Isn't E85 supposed to have a high octane rating?

03-11-2013, 08:50 AM	#1
cuddapah Enlisted Member Drives: 2011 BMW Z4 sDrive 35i Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 40 iTrader: (0)	Engine Malfunction ... third time Featured on BIMMERPOST.com This is the 3rd time my Z4 got this message ... first time dealer replaced Low Pressure Fuel Pump .. second time they couldn't find anything except tests on gas showed 14% ethanol. I always use Shell V-Power for the Z4. After the dealer found 14% ethanol, I started going to another Shell gas station which has huge traffic. Even then Z4 got this message. So I don't think this is anything to do with the gas. One strange thing I noticed is, the indicator turns on when weather goes below 40F and stays on until I take the car to the dealership. Any thoughts ?
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03-12-2013, 02:27 AM	#9
z4z4z4 First Lieutenant Drives: 2002 M3, 2011 Z4, & her 740Li Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: mild mediterranean breezes Posts: 391 iTrader: (1)	Not all gasoline service station pumps label ethanol content. The ethanol industry considers pump labeling to be discriminatory and lobbied successfully for elimination of Federal pump labeling laws in regards to ethanol content. Today's pumps are labeled as to ethanol content only if state law requires it. I suggest you perform your own testing so not to be led astray by an errant test at the dealership. It's so interesting that many many people with tuned N54 engines run 30-50% E85/gasoline blend to make huge power for the cheap octane cost. The in tank pump is swapped eventually for increased life, but occasional tanks of up to 25-42% ethanol has quite a following. http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17458 __________________ Last edited by z4z4z4; 03-12-2013 at 02:31 AM. Reason: add url

03-14-2013, 03:16 PM	#11
morfinx Shenanigans Drives: E89 Z4 sDrive35i Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 1,097 iTrader: (0)	Hmmm, I've had 3 injectors replaced and I also only use Shell V-Power. Coincidence? Perhaps... __________________ E89 Z4 sDrive35i 7DCT "Zayna", Alpine White/Coral Red E92 335i 6MT "Calixta", Space Grey/Coral Red [Retired]

03-15-2013, 08:39 AM	#19
ManiacGT Captain Drives: Z4 sDrive 35i Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Manchester, UK Posts: 814 iTrader: (0)	I use RON 98 or higher (tesco 99 for example) unless I absolutely cannot find a station with it and then I'll use 95. For the extra few quid, its not worth arguing about. __________________ BMW Z4 E89 sDrive35i Mods: Stubby! LED Halos! DVDInMotion! GolfT! SmartTop! BMW Performance 313 Alloys! http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/foru...d.php?t=265084

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03-11-2013, 11:07 AM	#4
nicknaz Colonel Drives: 2012 Z4 35i Join Date: May 2008 Location: San Diego CA Posts: 2,125 iTrader: (0)	How about going to ~10% ethanol? The speculation on the internet is that the lower the ethanol the better for the fuel pump

03-11-2013, 04:17 PM	#6
nicknaz Colonel Drives: 2012 Z4 35i Join Date: May 2008 Location: San Diego CA Posts: 2,125 iTrader: (0)	If the gas station sign says 10% ethanol and you had a test result that says 14% ethanol that's a big problem. Perhaps you should file a complain with the appropriate state authority to have them investigate the gas station and also keep all your receipts for the time and expenses you accrue from this issue. And as others have said, try a different gas station after the pump is fixed.

03-14-2013, 03:13 PM	#10
cuddapah Enlisted Member Drives: 2011 BMW Z4 sDrive 35i Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 40 iTrader: (0)	BMW service told me that SIX injectors were ordered. They should be in tomorrow. Hope this fixes the issue.

03-14-2013, 04:33 PM	#14
cwotoddgood Chief Drives: 2013 128i w/ M-sport package Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: New York Posts: 3 iTrader: (0)	Good afternoon All, hope everyone is well! Is the 'Engine Malfunction' indicator the same as the 'limp' mode referenced in other posts? I am curious if the recalls on the faulty high-pressure fuel pumps may also be (negatively) affecting the injectors. Regards, Todd

03-15-2013, 08:31 AM	#18
Paul S New Member Drives: 35i M sport Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Essex UK Posts: 15 iTrader: (0)	We use a different octane rating in the UK but while the BMW sales brochure says to use 98 (like Shell V-power), both the handbook and the sticker on the inside of the petrol flap say 95 (regular). On querying this with the dealer it was suggested that using 95 with a fill of 98/99 once very 1000 miles or so would be the way to go. Presumably to get the benfit of the extra additives in the 98 octane every now and again to help with cleaning?

03-15-2013, 11:11 AM	#21
cuddapah Enlisted Member Drives: 2011 BMW Z4 sDrive 35i Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 40 iTrader: (0)	Latest on this issue .. Dealer called and told me that while they are putting injectors they found transmission leak and are working on it now. How can they not find this during diagnosis ?