Water Vapor in the headlights

BMWZ4RIDER · 04-03-2013, 03:33 PM

2009 Z4 35i which has been garaged for 6 months now and has not ever been out in the rain as well. I moved the car in and out of the garage many times over the winter and drove it on several long drives as well, so it has not been sitting for long periods of time.This past weekend, I took it out for a 3 hour spin in 55 degree, beautiful weather. When I pulled back into the garage I looked at and found both headlights had formed a heavy condensation and water vapor barrier over at least 40% of the lens surface. Here are 2 pictures on the R and L sides after 3 running hours and 3 hours sitting and drying out. The headlamp heat did nothing to help. As the Z was going in for warranty service today, I gave them these pictures. The service manager agreed that this is much heavier than he has seen. I think this is ridiculious. No other car I have ever had with these sealed headlamps has ever leaked. For BMW to state that it is normal to have these headlamps generate some condensation inside them seems wrong? Has anyone else experienced this type of headlamp leaking? IN A NO RAIN and DRY GARAGE for the past 6 months?.

ManiacGT · 04-03-2013, 03:51 PM

I've not had this. Some others have. No one that I know has had lights replaced. (though they have on the rear) I think this should evaporate in time. I've seen a few new cars with this issue (different brands).

BuckarooVT90 · 04-03-2013, 05:45 PM

Thats just your Z crying because its left indoors and by itself for so long... And not out on the road enjoying a curvy back road.

Pacemaker1000 · 04-03-2013, 05:48 PM

Never had it before but noticed today after a jet wash
I believe the fix is to leave them on with the round access plate removed?

Rafale · 04-03-2013, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuckarooVT90

Thats just your Z crying because its left indoors and by itself for so long... And not out on the road enjoying a curvy back road.

jparnes1 · 04-03-2013, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pacemaker1000

Never had it before but noticed today after a jet wash
I believe the fix is to leave them on with the round access plate removed?

???

Mick70 · 04-04-2013, 02:49 AM

According to my dealership, vapor in the headlights is completely normal - the headlights are an open system filled with normal air that may reflect differences in surrounding air pressure, air temperature and air humidity, so that supersaturated air may lead to water condensation on cold surfaces (laws of thermodynamics). However, "water drops" should not appear.

Best regards

Mick

CedarZ4 · 04-04-2013, 02:56 AM

Pg. 171

Headlamp Glass
Condensation can form on the inside of the external lamps in cool or humid weather. When you drive with the lights switched on, the condensation evaporates after a short time. The headlamp glasses do not need to be changed.

Also, just because it didn't rain and your garage is "dry" doesn't mean there isn't moisture. Humidity (even on cold days) can create condensation. That is, your garage isn't as dry as you think it is. There is always water in the air.

al1 · 04-04-2013, 03:08 AM

i dont get the point of headlights being an open system :/ if it is, i would simply use a hair dryer but i guess it would happen again..

fl_cyclist · 04-04-2013, 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by al1

i dont get the point of headlights being an open system :/ if it is, i would simply use a hair dryer but i guess it would happen again..

That just means it is not under a vacuum. That would make changing headlight bulbs a bit expensive.

al1 · 04-04-2013, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fl_cyclist

That just means it is not under a vacuum. That would make changing headlight bulbs a bit expensive.

hehe i know what it means

just dont get the point of an electrical circuit to not be under vacuum..

maybe, it would make it expensive to change something but at least, you wont have vapor in your headlight...

i thought his problem was due to a crack or something but since it is open, it would go away after running your headlights on for a bit..

BMWZ4RIDER · 04-04-2013, 07:25 PM

Had the car at the BMW dealer today for basic maintenance as well as the headlights.
According to the dealer, BMW has a bulletin with a picture of what the headlights with condensation/water vapor on the inside will look like and what they consider normal. Based upon my situation and pictures of my headlights this level of water vapor is considered normal. I asked them to document this on my file and car for future reference.
FYI

Mick70 · 04-05-2013, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BMWZ4RIDER

BMW has a bulletin with a picture of what the headlights with condensation/water vapor on the inside will look like and what they consider normal.

That's it - vapor is ok, but water drops should not appear.

bigendbob · 04-07-2013, 04:28 AM

So why didn't some clever graduate designer, design a sealed housing. I'm sure everything in front of the bulb lenses could be sealed, just laziness.
I think the bulbs get very hot, but they don't transmit radiant heat like halogen bulbs, so the plastic front never gets warm, even worse on a run the lense gets air cooled.

mose999 · 01-10-2014, 09:47 AM

Condensation built up on my lights with consequent bacteria forming on the inside of the transparent cover of the lights. Just a few grey spots all over the glass. BMW cleared those. But the condensation remains during humid days. The BMW dealership says it is normal. I am not so sure about it. I am still investigating.

04-03-2013, 03:33 PM	#1
BMWZ4RIDER BMWZ4Rider 68 Rep 801 Posts Drives: 2009 BMW Z4 35i Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Cape Cod, MA iTrader: (0)	Water Vapor in the headlights 2009 Z4 35i which has been garaged for 6 months now and has not ever been out in the rain as well. I moved the car in and out of the garage many times over the winter and drove it on several long drives as well, so it has not been sitting for long periods of time.This past weekend, I took it out for a 3 hour spin in 55 degree, beautiful weather. When I pulled back into the garage I looked at and found both headlights had formed a heavy condensation and water vapor barrier over at least 40% of the lens surface. Here are 2 pictures on the R and L sides after 3 running hours and 3 hours sitting and drying out. The headlamp heat did nothing to help. As the Z was going in for warranty service today, I gave them these pictures. The service manager agreed that this is much heavier than he has seen. I think this is ridiculious. No other car I have ever had with these sealed headlamps has ever leaked. For BMW to state that it is normal to have these headlamps generate some condensation inside them seems wrong? Has anyone else experienced this type of headlamp leaking? IN A NO RAIN and DRY GARAGE for the past 6 months?. Attached Images __________________ 2009 BMW Z4 35i/SMG/DCT/Premium,Cold, Sound PK/Com Acc/Ash/PDC/Wind Deflector/Smoked Reflectors/Red Calipers/Cl Mask/M Series Grill/6000K LED's/De-Badged/M Pedals/CF Mirrors-Engine Cover/Stubby/20% Tint/H8 LED's/LCI Side Markers/Sniper Sprint Spoiler/VMR V710/H&R Sport Springs/KN.
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04-03-2013, 03:51 PM	#2
ManiacGT Major 85 Rep 1,448 Posts Drives: Z4 sDrive 35i Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Manchester, UK iTrader: (0)	I've not had this. Some others have. No one that I know has had lights replaced. (though they have on the rear) I think this should evaporate in time. I've seen a few new cars with this issue (different brands).
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04-03-2013, 05:45 PM	#3
BuckarooVT90 Private First Class 10 Rep 189 Posts Drives: '13 Z4 sDrive35i DCT Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Virginia iTrader: (1) Garage List 2020 Z4 M40i [8.00]	Thats just your Z crying because its left indoors and by itself for so long... And not out on the road enjoying a curvy back road.
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04-03-2013, 05:48 PM	#4
Pacemaker1000 Private 13 Rep 90 Posts Drives: 430i GC Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Uk iTrader: (0)	Never had it before but noticed today after a jet wash I believe the fix is to leave them on with the round access plate removed?
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04-04-2013, 02:49 AM	#7
Mick70 Private First Class 9 Rep 157 Posts Drives: Z4 sdrive35i (before: 23i) Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Germany iTrader: (0)	According to my dealership, vapor in the headlights is completely normal - the headlights are an open system filled with normal air that may reflect differences in surrounding air pressure, air temperature and air humidity, so that supersaturated air may lead to water condensation on cold surfaces (laws of thermodynamics). However, "water drops" should not appear. Best regards Mick
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04-04-2013, 02:56 AM	#8
CedarZ4 Captain 63 Rep 715 Posts Drives: G05 M50i, Tesla M3P Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: SoFL iTrader: (2)	Pg. 171 Headlamp Glass Condensation can form on the inside of the external lamps in cool or humid weather. When you drive with the lights switched on, the condensation evaporates after a short time. The headlamp glasses do not need to be changed. Also, just because it didn't rain and your garage is "dry" doesn't mean there isn't moisture. Humidity (even on cold days) can create condensation. That is, your garage isn't as dry as you think it is. There is always water in the air.
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04-04-2013, 03:08 AM	#9
al1 Private 6 Rep 88 Posts Drives: z4 35i Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Istanbul / Turkey iTrader: (0)	i dont get the point of headlights being an open system :/ if it is, i would simply use a hair dryer but i guess it would happen again..
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04-04-2013, 07:25 PM	#12
BMWZ4RIDER BMWZ4Rider 68 Rep 801 Posts Drives: 2009 BMW Z4 35i Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Cape Cod, MA iTrader: (0)	Had the car at the BMW dealer today for basic maintenance as well as the headlights. According to the dealer, BMW has a bulletin with a picture of what the headlights with condensation/water vapor on the inside will look like and what they consider normal. Based upon my situation and pictures of my headlights this level of water vapor is considered normal. I asked them to document this on my file and car for future reference. FYI __________________ 2009 BMW Z4 35i/SMG/DCT/Premium,Cold, Sound PK/Com Acc/Ash/PDC/Wind Deflector/Smoked Reflectors/Red Calipers/Cl Mask/M Series Grill/6000K LED's/De-Badged/M Pedals/CF Mirrors-Engine Cover/Stubby/20% Tint/H8 LED's/LCI Side Markers/Sniper Sprint Spoiler/VMR V710/H&R Sport Springs/KN.
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04-07-2013, 04:28 AM	#14
bigendbob Second Lieutenant 50 Rep 297 Posts Drives: z4 23i Orion Silver Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: west midlands iTrader: (0)	So why didn't some clever graduate designer, design a sealed housing. I'm sure everything in front of the bulb lenses could be sealed, just laziness. I think the bulbs get very hot, but they don't transmit radiant heat like halogen bulbs, so the plastic front never gets warm, even worse on a run the lense gets air cooled.
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01-10-2014, 09:47 AM	#15
mose999 New Member 4 Rep 17 Posts Drives: 116i F20 Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Switzerland iTrader: (0)	humidity in lights Condensation built up on my lights with consequent bacteria forming on the inside of the transparent cover of the lights. Just a few grey spots all over the glass. BMW cleared those. But the condensation remains during humid days. The BMW dealership says it is normal. I am not so sure about it. I am still investigating. Attached Images
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