BMW thinking about a AMG Project-One Rival?

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

BMW’s M division is ready to make a Mercedes-AMG Project One-baiting hypercar, should it get the go-ahead from the firm’s vice-president, Dirk Hacker. However, there are currently no plans to do so.

Mercedes-AMG revealed the Project One at the Frankfurt motor show, with the £2 million hypercar set to go on sale in 2019. It is powered by a modified version of the marque’s 1.6-litre engine and, combined with its hybrid system, produces 992bhp.

“We would like to do a standalone car and we could do it - but today there is no requirement from the market to do it,” said Hacker. “As a company, we are more focused on future mobility than digitisation than building a hypercar, to be honest, but if we came to the decision to do a super sportscar, then we could do that.”

BMW is known to have asked several leading teams - including some with Formula 1 know-how - to evaluate a LMP1 return in order to race at Le Mans in recent years, but it is believed to have settled on racing more production-specific models in lower classes, while putting its works focus and budget on the all-electric Formula E championship.

Hacker conceded that an electrified halo car could have some appeal, but stressed that any such hypercar would be some way off production. “Formula E could be interesting for us. M cars have roots in racing,” he said. “It will be an interesting challenge as more OEMs get involved and there could certainly be the opportunity for some input from our engineering department in the series.”

BMW has pledged to have 12 fully electric cars on sale by 2025, meaning the gathering pace of BMW’s electric car launches could open an opportunity to launch a halo electric vehicle.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/i...hypercar-rival

[BEM-S4]

Seems about right - engineers want to build something crazy / business managers won't green light the project. The Miura-esque days of these guys being able to cobble something together in secret are long gone.

[MalibuBimmer]

"We could do it but we won't."- Why bother to say anything, then?

[AKRAPOVICOWNS]

Its funny how they can find a business case for those niche cars such as the 5 GT and that 2er thing, but cant find it for a sports car, where pretty much every other manufacturer has. And odly enough, their only 2-seater car, the Z4, won't receive the M treatment, but every SUV will. BMW cleary dont care about that.

And what is the point of making such a low volume hypercar, if they doesnt even compete with the R8, AMG GT etc, which would be the first logical step if they wanted to get into that.

As the post above said, why bother say anything. Its like they want people know that they are capable of doing, but giving an excuse.."we dont want to". Its like your older brother does something cool that you really wanted to do, but isnt sure if you can do it yourself..then you just say "because i dont want to". Lol. Just shut up about this already bmw, its better that way.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by MalibuBimmer

"We could do it but we won't."- Why bother to say anything, then?

Methinks he's looking for public support after striking out with his boss - a la Kyrie Irving going to Twitter to demand a trade. Not a whole lot to lose politically, all he's really doing is saying his team is capable of being as good if not better than rival but the internal opinion doesn't see a business case for it. He then kicks it to the car-buying masses to see if there is a groundswell of support to prove there may be a viable business case.

Here's the big difference, IMO. Benz runs a top down engineering program, meaning develop for F1 and adapt for street use as appropriate. BMW is much more bottoms up. Benz can take the already existing technology from Hamilton's car, dumb it down a bit, and presto road car. BMW would need to go beyond what it's already doing, which from a budgetary standpoint is much more daunting.

It's not like the old days where to get into a racing series you needed to sell however many (think 100 at least) street legal cars under a certain price point, so the teams built the cars then made them street legal and sold to the public super cheap. Not cheap as in inexpensive b/c they were very dear, but cheap for what you were getting.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

Methinks he's looking for public support after striking out with his boss - a la Kyrie Irving going to Twitter to demand a trade. Not a whole lot to lose politically, all he's really doing is saying his team is capable of being as good if not better than rival but the internal opinion doesn't see a business case for it. He then kicks it to the car-buying masses to see if there is a groundswell of support to prove there may be a viable business case.

Here's the big difference, IMO. Benz runs a top down engineering program, meaning develop for F1 and adapt for street use as appropriate. BMW is much more bottoms up. Benz can take the already existing technology from Hamilton's car, dumb it down a bit, and presto road car. BMW would need to go beyond what it's already doing, which from a budgetary standpoint is much more daunting.

It's not like the old days where to get into a racing series you needed to sell however many (think 100 at least) street legal cars under a certain price point, so the teams built the cars then made them street legal and sold to the public super cheap. Not cheap as in inexpensive b/c they were very dear, but cheap for what you were getting.

I understand that BMW is trying to scale. BMW prides itself on being a premium luxury vehicle. Their German counterparts at Audi, Mercedes and Porsche have all introduced vehicles that are on the higher end of the spectrum. That technology trickles down, but also provides customers with a sense of 'pride'. It provides the customer with something to look forward to and excited about as they move up the product line-up.

If the market does not demand such vehicles, the R8, AMG GT-S/GT-R(And Project One) or 918 or 911 GTS would not exist. Obviously, their are customers out there that still demand those type of vehicles because they are still being offered.

[BEM-S4]

Oh I get all that. Volvo spent $11 BILLION to develop the XC90. And that money will be spread across every car they make since a lot of it can be shared. Especially in the landscape we're currently in, I just don't get how BMW can start working on a halo car now. That would take what 5 years at best to happen? You're closing in on MY25 at that point, autonomy, electric, zero emissions all converging.

Said another way, give them even $2Bn to develop a car - which seems light but whatever. Once it's done what will be left in the pipeline for it to trickle down into?

I think they're hoping the 8-series will check the boxes you are looking to cross off. That and the evolutionary offerings i.e. M3 CS, M2 CS(L) etc. are derivative and comparatively easy and cheap to pull off.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

Oh I get all that. Volvo spent $11 BILLION to develop the XC90. And that money will be spread across every car they make since a lot of it can be shared. Especially in the landscape we're currently in, I just don't get how BMW can start working on a halo car now. That would take what 5 years at best to happen? You're closing in on MY25 at that point, autonomy, electric, zero emissions all converging.

Said another way, give them even $2Bn to develop a car - which seems light but whatever. Once it's done what will be left in the pipeline for it to trickle down into?

I think they're hoping the 8-series will check the boxes you are looking to cross off. That and the evolutionary offerings i.e. M3 CS, M2 CS(L) etc. are derivative and comparatively easy and cheap to pull off.

The 8 series will be an S-Class Coupe Rival and the M-ified version will be an S63 rival. Still a HUGE void sitting at the top.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by Mo@BMWofFairfax

The 8 series will be an S-Class Coupe Rival and the M-ified version will be an S63 rival. Still a HUGE void sitting at the top.

Oh I am not saying it wouldn't be great to have, I just can't wrap my head around a pen to paper business case for it. I think the special edition versions of cars already in production are much easier to get through the bean counters. Low volume for sure but low development costs too, as opposed to low volume with huge development costs for a BMW super car.