Spring Gremlins + DCT Owner FYI

mbetoni · 05-12-2014, 01:16 PM

I took the car out of winter storage about 3 weeks ago. On the first drive, after running it for about an hour I stopped for a quick break and to figure out my next leg of driving. When I went to restart the car, no dice. Instead, I got a christmas tree of dashboard lights that culminated with a Transmission Error message on the iDrive screen. Long story short, the message says that the car can not detect which gear it’s in (thus not detecting Park, required for engine start), and that a restart may be possible after a delay. Sure enough, 20 minutes later, he started back up.

This actually happened twice last year, a few months apart, and each time I chalked it up to computer gremlins - the car starts and runs perfectly most of the time.

Long story short, brought it in for service, and not shockingly, dealer was stumped. Not stumped in the "its not doing it for us" kind of way, in fact I was able to demonstrate the moment I pulled in. Stumped in a 'no clue why that's happening" kind of way. Opened a PUMA case, and BMW’s direction was to replace the Gear Selector Switch, BMW PN 61319213647. While having this done, they proactively checked the DCT oil pan for any leaking. This is the DCT Owner FYI part: they informed me they do this because nearly "EVERY" DCT that comes in (M3/135/Z4/etc) has some degree of leaking around the oil pan, they service it or not depending on the severity of the leak. In my case, it was bad enough that they replaced the DCT oil pan. This seems to be somewhat of a design flaw in the DCT, FWIW.

Unfortunately while in service the lumbar and side bolsters on my driver’s seat stopped working (no movement in either when controls are pressed). Dealer believes it to be the switch itself, that along with all related seat parts were ordered (just in case) and have been delivered, I need to take the car back this week for that to be fixed.

Since getting the car back after the Gear Selector Switch was replaced, I’ve frustratingly learned that didn’t fix the problem. It’s still there and has happened twice since. What I’ve also determined is that it ONLY happens during a quick recycle of the engine (as in when getting gas, ask me how I know). If the car sits off for more than 1/2 hour, it starts/has no problems.

I’ll be bringing the car back in this week to get both the seat and continuing transmission issues resolved. In thinking about it, I have a hunch (loose one, but a hunch none-the-less). If this were the engine, and weird CEL/etc lights were intermittently coming on, and we knew that the coils/injectors/HPFP/etc were in working order, we’d be suspecting a MAF or O2 sensor(s) as the culprit. Knowing the DCT has sensors as well, my hunch is one of them is bad. We shall see. Obviously, being a brand new car with just over 3000 miles, this is all warranty work. Worth noting as the initial visit replacing the Gear Selector Switch and DCT oil pan would have been well over $2000 out-of-pocket.

Finally, a word on dealers, I know many (perhaps most) have negative or poor experiences with them. While that has also happened to me, it’s worth pointing out when the opposite is true. I’ve had outstanding experiences at Patrick BMW here in IL, in particular, the senior SA Matt has been awesome to work with. In going to most in the Chicagoland area, so far Patrick has my #1 stamp for service, Elmhurst is a close second (but #1 for Sales). Steer clear of Petrillo & Knauz, based on my experience.

For anyone keeping count, track record of BMWs I have owned:

’05 Z4 3.0i, bought new in ’05: Driver’s side center speaker failed twice, replaced both times. Traded in ’08.
’08 Z4 3.0si: bought new in ’08: 0 problems in 5 years ownership, traded in ’13.
’12 128i: bought new in ’12, still own: Amplifier failed, was replaced.
’14 Z4 35is: Ordered 4/13, delivered 6/13, still own: transmission and seat problems above.

jparnes1 · 05-12-2014, 01:55 PM

Interesting acknowledgment by your SA about the oil pan. I'm sure this will be of great interest to all DCT owners. Glad I have an MT!

Lambobimmer · 05-12-2014, 02:12 PM

I had my DCT replaced because they could not fix the leak. They attempted to fix it 3 times.

mbetoni · 05-12-2014, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lambobimmer

I had my DCT replaced because they could not fix the leak. They attempted to fix it 3 times.

Interesting...

ManiacGT · 05-12-2014, 03:21 PM

No issues here.. Nearly 5 years old.

Putzo · 05-14-2014, 11:09 AM

Thanks for the heads up on this, much appreciated!

mbetoni · 05-15-2014, 10:47 AM

Update: I'll be dropping the car off Monday AM to get sorted. I'll let folks know what they discover.

nicknaz · 05-19-2014, 11:00 AM

Thanks for the heads up on potential DCT leak issue. I will get this checked out on my car.

mbetoni · 05-19-2014, 01:54 PM

After Lambobimmer replied in this thread, I did some searching. Apparently the leak is very common in the M3 community, there are many threads about it on other forums...

mbetoni · 05-27-2014, 11:21 AM

Update:

Sorry I'm just getting the chance to update now, but I heard from my SA on Friday of last week. Unfortunately, not the greatest news.

On a good note, seat's fixed, two things replaced: both the switch and the actual lumbar mechanism. Side bolsters started working once the switch was replaced. All is well w/ the seat.

However, the transmission problem is the result of a loose pin and subsequent short in my wiring harness. Were the car out of warranty, it would be something a typical shop would repair. However, under warranty, BMW insists on replacing the ENTIRE wiring harness. So, I'm getting a new wiring harness, which is coming from Germany as there are none in the States. Turnaround time: at least TWO WEEKS. Unfortunately, I can't have the car back until then as BMW won't allow it released until this is replaced for safety/liability purposes.

As such, I'm the new driver of a loaner 2014 528i with a bunch of options. Have to say, though I'm not typically a 'big' car guy, this one is very comfy. No replacement for my IS of course, but could be worse. Just need to hurry up and get my car back already.

BMWZ4RIDER · 05-27-2014, 02:10 PM

Did you ask how frequent or unusual this issue is with the Z?
This seems expensive and an item that "would seem" and should never go bad.

mbetoni · 05-27-2014, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BMWZ4RIDER

Did you ask how frequent or unusual this issue is with the Z?
This seems expensive and an item that "would seem" and should never go bad.

I don't have 100% confirmation that it's the car's entire wiring harness, I'll ask when I pick it up. Using RealOEM and BavAuto though, if in fact it's the whole thing, it's listed at just under $5000.00 (part alone). I didn't ask if it was frequent, but my guess is that no, it's not. Most likely, something that happened during installation at the factory (loose pin, pinched wire, etc), and just my bad luck it happened to me.

jparnes1 · 05-27-2014, 04:27 PM

At least you'll have it back soon and you have the entire summer to enjoy it.

cuddapah · 05-27-2014, 09:29 PM

Please take a few minutes and file a complaint with NHTSA.
https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/Vehicl...nt/index.xhtml
Hopefully they will be a recall for DCT and HVAC (intermittent AC) issues.

mbetoni · 06-09-2014, 01:03 PM

UPDATE: He's back!

Got the call Saturday afternoon that the car was ready to be picked up.

The wiring harness that was replaced was the transmission wiring harness, not the entire car's wiring harness, BMW PN 28607842853. Pin #14 on this wiring harness was not making the correct amount of contact, throwing the entire system off. The two-week wait was strictly the result of the harness coming from Germany, not the work involved, though Brian (my tech) did need to access it through the passenger side interior. All work was done flawlessly and there is no trace of anything having happened.

They kept the car two extra days to drive it, recycle it off and on, and ensure all codes were clear and the car was working properly. I drove the spit out of it yesterday, and all is well. They even extended the courtesy of keeping the car parked indoors while they waited for the part as they knew it is a garage-kept car.

Very glad to have him back and that this issue was finally put to bed, considering it seems like this was a factory-originated issue I've had since taking delivery.

Had a blast in the country yesterday under a crystal clear sky with no-humidty and 74 degree temps, looking forward to a lot more of the same.

jparnes1 · 06-09-2014, 04:48 PM

congrats and enjoy.

nicknaz · 06-09-2014, 06:49 PM

glad you have it back. thanks for sharing with the community.

Will be a good reference to have for those who are out of warranty.

Moderators: We should start a sticky FAQ with common problems and fixes, so we can have all the issues with roof, headlights, injectors, etc all in one place

tranquility · 06-09-2014, 10:02 PM

Oh boy, another potential headache to worry about. Thx for the info and update, OP. Glad that you are whole once again.

Btw, is there a reason you refer to your car as a male? Usually ppl refer to them and other vehicles like boats as female. (I don't care either way, just curious.)

mbetoni · 06-10-2014, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tranquility

Btw, is there a reason you refer to your car as a male? Usually ppl refer to them and other vehicles like boats as female. (I don't care either way, just curious.)

Ha, funny question. Agreed on boats, or more specifically "ships" of all types (real and fictional), always female. With my cars, seems like when we get one my wife and I go through a "is it a boy, or a girl?" Q&A, and then pick a name once we fall on either side of the fence. The 35is just felt like a boy from the get go I guess. Her car, the 2012 128i, Deep Sea Blue over Oyster, is *most definitely* a girl.

Full awareness, this is all silliness, a car is a car - ha

.

mbetoni · 06-10-2014, 11:02 AM

Also, FWIW, it doesn't seem like this is a 'common' problem, as I haven't heard (here or elsewhere) of this happening to others. Seems like this is something that I had the dumb luck of having happen to me.

However, it does seem like the DCT leak they fixed while the car was there IS common, both to our cars and the M3s. Definitely worth folks making a mental reminder of that one.

05-12-2014, 01:16 PM	#1
mbetoni First Lieutenant 19 Rep 317 Posts Drives: 2014 Z435is Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Chicago iTrader: (0)	Spring Gremlins + DCT Owner FYI I took the car out of winter storage about 3 weeks ago. On the first drive, after running it for about an hour I stopped for a quick break and to figure out my next leg of driving. When I went to restart the car, no dice. Instead, I got a christmas tree of dashboard lights that culminated with a Transmission Error message on the iDrive screen. Long story short, the message says that the car can not detect which gear it’s in (thus not detecting Park, required for engine start), and that a restart may be possible after a delay. Sure enough, 20 minutes later, he started back up. This actually happened twice last year, a few months apart, and each time I chalked it up to computer gremlins - the car starts and runs perfectly most of the time. Long story short, brought it in for service, and not shockingly, dealer was stumped. Not stumped in the "its not doing it for us" kind of way, in fact I was able to demonstrate the moment I pulled in. Stumped in a 'no clue why that's happening" kind of way. Opened a PUMA case, and BMW’s direction was to replace the Gear Selector Switch, BMW PN 61319213647. While having this done, they proactively checked the DCT oil pan for any leaking. This is the DCT Owner FYI part: they informed me they do this because nearly "EVERY" DCT that comes in (M3/135/Z4/etc) has some degree of leaking around the oil pan, they service it or not depending on the severity of the leak. In my case, it was bad enough that they replaced the DCT oil pan. This seems to be somewhat of a design flaw in the DCT, FWIW. Unfortunately while in service the lumbar and side bolsters on my driver’s seat stopped working (no movement in either when controls are pressed). Dealer believes it to be the switch itself, that along with all related seat parts were ordered (just in case) and have been delivered, I need to take the car back this week for that to be fixed. Since getting the car back after the Gear Selector Switch was replaced, I’ve frustratingly learned that didn’t fix the problem. It’s still there and has happened twice since. What I’ve also determined is that it ONLY happens during a quick recycle of the engine (as in when getting gas, ask me how I know). If the car sits off for more than 1/2 hour, it starts/has no problems. I’ll be bringing the car back in this week to get both the seat and continuing transmission issues resolved. In thinking about it, I have a hunch (loose one, but a hunch none-the-less). If this were the engine, and weird CEL/etc lights were intermittently coming on, and we knew that the coils/injectors/HPFP/etc were in working order, we’d be suspecting a MAF or O2 sensor(s) as the culprit. Knowing the DCT has sensors as well, my hunch is one of them is bad. We shall see. Obviously, being a brand new car with just over 3000 miles, this is all warranty work. Worth noting as the initial visit replacing the Gear Selector Switch and DCT oil pan would have been well over $2000 out-of-pocket. Finally, a word on dealers, I know many (perhaps most) have negative or poor experiences with them. While that has also happened to me, it’s worth pointing out when the opposite is true. I’ve had outstanding experiences at Patrick BMW here in IL, in particular, the senior SA Matt has been awesome to work with. In going to most in the Chicagoland area, so far Patrick has my #1 stamp for service, Elmhurst is a close second (but #1 for Sales). Steer clear of Petrillo & Knauz, based on my experience. For anyone keeping count, track record of BMWs I have owned: ’05 Z4 3.0i, bought new in ’05: Driver’s side center speaker failed twice, replaced both times. Traded in ’08. ’08 Z4 3.0si: bought new in ’08: 0 problems in 5 years ownership, traded in ’13. ’12 128i: bought new in ’12, still own: Amplifier failed, was replaced. ’14 Z4 35is: Ordered 4/13, delivered 6/13, still own: transmission and seat problems above. Last edited by mbetoni; 05-12-2014 at 02:41 PM..
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05-12-2014, 01:55 PM	#2
jparnes1 Colonel 242 Rep 2,387 Posts Drives: 2016 340i, 2012 Z4 35i Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: NY iTrader: (1)	Interesting acknowledgment by your SA about the oil pan. I'm sure this will be of great interest to all DCT owners. Glad I have an MT! __________________ 2016 340i XDrive, EBII/black, 6 MT, M Sport, Track Handling, Cold Weather, Tech, Lighting, Driver Assistance Plus. 2012 Z4 35i, ED 2/24/2012, Melbourne Red Metallic, Black Leather, Carbon Trim, 6MT, M Sport, CW, PP, PS, NAV, CA.
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05-12-2014, 02:12 PM	#3
Lambobimmer Major 292 Rep 1,473 Posts Drives: 2022 X3 M40i, 2018 TTRS Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Tarheel iTrader: (14)	I had my DCT replaced because they could not fix the leak. They attempted to fix it 3 times.
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05-12-2014, 03:21 PM	#5
ManiacGT Major 85 Rep 1,448 Posts Drives: Z4 sDrive 35i Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Manchester, UK iTrader: (0)	No issues here.. Nearly 5 years old.
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05-14-2014, 11:09 AM	#6
Putzo Newb 2 Rep 110 Posts Drives: 2012 E89 Z4 35is Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Calgary, Canada iTrader: (0) Garage List 2012 BMW Z4 sDrive35is [7.00]	Thanks for the heads up on this, much appreciated! __________________ Putzo Current: 2012 E89 Z4 35is Previous: 2008 E92 335i Coupe, 2007 Subaru Legacy 2.5GT spec.B, 1993 Dodge Stealth R/T Twin-Turbo AWD, 1994 Ford Taurus SHO
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05-15-2014, 10:47 AM	#7
mbetoni First Lieutenant 19 Rep 317 Posts Drives: 2014 Z435is Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Chicago iTrader: (0)	Update: I'll be dropping the car off Monday AM to get sorted. I'll let folks know what they discover.
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05-19-2014, 11:00 AM	#8
nicknaz Lieutenant General 3187 Rep 10,509 Posts Drives: C6Z Join Date: May 2008 Location: NorCal iTrader: (0)	Thanks for the heads up on potential DCT leak issue. I will get this checked out on my car.
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05-19-2014, 01:54 PM	#9
mbetoni First Lieutenant 19 Rep 317 Posts Drives: 2014 Z435is Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Chicago iTrader: (0)	After Lambobimmer replied in this thread, I did some searching. Apparently the leak is very common in the M3 community, there are many threads about it on other forums...
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05-27-2014, 11:21 AM	#10
mbetoni First Lieutenant 19 Rep 317 Posts Drives: 2014 Z435is Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Chicago iTrader: (0)	Update: Sorry I'm just getting the chance to update now, but I heard from my SA on Friday of last week. Unfortunately, not the greatest news. On a good note, seat's fixed, two things replaced: both the switch and the actual lumbar mechanism. Side bolsters started working once the switch was replaced. All is well w/ the seat. However, the transmission problem is the result of a loose pin and subsequent short in my wiring harness. Were the car out of warranty, it would be something a typical shop would repair. However, under warranty, BMW insists on replacing the ENTIRE wiring harness. So, I'm getting a new wiring harness, which is coming from Germany as there are none in the States. Turnaround time: at least TWO WEEKS. Unfortunately, I can't have the car back until then as BMW won't allow it released until this is replaced for safety/liability purposes. As such, I'm the new driver of a loaner 2014 528i with a bunch of options. Have to say, though I'm not typically a 'big' car guy, this one is very comfy. No replacement for my IS of course, but could be worse. Just need to hurry up and get my car back already.
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05-27-2014, 02:10 PM	#11
BMWZ4RIDER BMWZ4Rider 69 Rep 801 Posts Drives: 2009 BMW Z4 35i Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Cape Cod, MA iTrader: (0)	Did you ask how frequent or unusual this issue is with the Z? This seems expensive and an item that "would seem" and should never go bad. __________________ 2009 BMW Z4 35i/SMG/DCT/Premium,Cold, Sound PK/Com Acc/Ash/PDC/Wind Deflector/Smoked Reflectors/Red Calipers/Cl Mask/M Series Grill/6000K LED's/De-Badged/M Pedals/CF Mirrors-Engine Cover/Stubby/20% Tint/H8 LED's/LCI Side Markers/Sniper Sprint Spoiler/VMR V710/H&R Sport Springs/KN.
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05-27-2014, 04:27 PM	#13
jparnes1 Colonel 242 Rep 2,387 Posts Drives: 2016 340i, 2012 Z4 35i Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: NY iTrader: (1)	At least you'll have it back soon and you have the entire summer to enjoy it. __________________ 2016 340i XDrive, EBII/black, 6 MT, M Sport, Track Handling, Cold Weather, Tech, Lighting, Driver Assistance Plus. 2012 Z4 35i, ED 2/24/2012, Melbourne Red Metallic, Black Leather, Carbon Trim, 6MT, M Sport, CW, PP, PS, NAV, CA.
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05-27-2014, 09:29 PM	#14
cuddapah First Lieutenant 41 Rep 312 Posts Drives: 2011 BMW Z4 sDrive 35i Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Jacksonville, FL iTrader: (0)	File a complaint with NHTSA Please take a few minutes and file a complaint with NHTSA. https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/Vehicl...nt/index.xhtml Hopefully they will be a recall for DCT and HVAC (intermittent AC) issues.
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06-09-2014, 01:03 PM	#15
mbetoni First Lieutenant 19 Rep 317 Posts Drives: 2014 Z435is Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Chicago iTrader: (0)	UPDATE: He's back! Got the call Saturday afternoon that the car was ready to be picked up. The wiring harness that was replaced was the transmission wiring harness, not the entire car's wiring harness, BMW PN 28607842853. Pin #14 on this wiring harness was not making the correct amount of contact, throwing the entire system off. The two-week wait was strictly the result of the harness coming from Germany, not the work involved, though Brian (my tech) did need to access it through the passenger side interior. All work was done flawlessly and there is no trace of anything having happened. They kept the car two extra days to drive it, recycle it off and on, and ensure all codes were clear and the car was working properly. I drove the spit out of it yesterday, and all is well. They even extended the courtesy of keeping the car parked indoors while they waited for the part as they knew it is a garage-kept car. Very glad to have him back and that this issue was finally put to bed, considering it seems like this was a factory-originated issue I've had since taking delivery. Had a blast in the country yesterday under a crystal clear sky with no-humidty and 74 degree temps, looking forward to a lot more of the same. Last edited by mbetoni; 06-09-2014 at 01:12 PM..
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06-09-2014, 04:48 PM	#16
jparnes1 Colonel 242 Rep 2,387 Posts Drives: 2016 340i, 2012 Z4 35i Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: NY iTrader: (1)	congrats and enjoy. __________________ 2016 340i XDrive, EBII/black, 6 MT, M Sport, Track Handling, Cold Weather, Tech, Lighting, Driver Assistance Plus. 2012 Z4 35i, ED 2/24/2012, Melbourne Red Metallic, Black Leather, Carbon Trim, 6MT, M Sport, CW, PP, PS, NAV, CA.
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06-09-2014, 06:49 PM	#17
nicknaz Lieutenant General 3187 Rep 10,509 Posts Drives: C6Z Join Date: May 2008 Location: NorCal iTrader: (0)	glad you have it back. thanks for sharing with the community. Will be a good reference to have for those who are out of warranty. Moderators: We should start a sticky FAQ with common problems and fixes, so we can have all the issues with roof, headlights, injectors, etc all in one place
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06-09-2014, 10:02 PM	#18
tranquility sportscars only 3244 Rep 3,195 Posts Drives: 2011 Z4 sDrive 35i Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Montréal iTrader: (0)	Oh boy, another potential headache to worry about. Thx for the info and update, OP. Glad that you are whole once again. Btw, is there a reason you refer to your car as a male? Usually ppl refer to them and other vehicles like boats as female. (I don't care either way, just curious.)
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06-10-2014, 11:02 AM	#20
mbetoni First Lieutenant 19 Rep 317 Posts Drives: 2014 Z435is Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Chicago iTrader: (0)	Also, FWIW, it doesn't seem like this is a 'common' problem, as I haven't heard (here or elsewhere) of this happening to others. Seems like this is something that I had the dumb luck of having happen to me. However, it does seem like the DCT leak they fixed while the car was there IS common, both to our cars and the M3s. Definitely worth folks making a mental reminder of that one.
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