Plummeting Z Prices

[BMWZ4RIDER]

I love my Z and got a great deal 2.5 years ago. At the time of purchase the car was just under 2.5 years old. The Z was bought as an 09-26K Mile 35i Z loaded with everything except adaptive suspension and sports seats had a new sticker price of $67,040. I paid $35,400 or 48.4%. Great deal for me. Bad for the original owner who lost his shrt.
Now I am losing my shirt so pay back is a bitch.
Now looking at the the used Z re-sale market it is making me wish I waited to buy.
The resale prices are plummeting.
Here are the average resale market prices accoridng to Car Gurus. However the prices on line seem to be quite a bit less then these listed averages.
I could buy a 2010/2011 used 35is with less miles for what I paid (or LESS than) for mine.
Makes me depressed to think about it.
This is more than standard depreciation.
High volume/commodity car certainly are not driving the prices down so rapidly. Whats driving this price drop?
Where the bottom?
In another another year an 2009/2010/2011 will be a $15-20K car. OUCH
My Z is paid for and I am enjoying every drive, but these sagging prices make me wonder about the future of holding onto the car.
I dont see used Porsches depreciating at this alarming rate.

Average BMW Z4 Prices Per Year

2009 $27,992
2010 $31,9982011
2011 $33,891
2012 39,955
2013 $40,347
2014 $49,168
2015 $61,220

[jparnes1]

Yes, that's what happens to a car's value over time...it goes down a lot. You have said that you plan to hold on to this car for a very long time. How can you possibly be losing your shirt? If you're not looking to sell, the car's value is of no concern. And are you saying that you would forfeit all the enjoyment you got from owning your car so you could buy it cheaper today? Sorry dude, your rant doesn't cut it for me.

[paris1]

A BMW exec recently stated publicly that the market for expensive roadsters took a huge hit during the recession and they doubt it will ever recover. That's why they're working with Toyota to jointly develop a less expensive (Z2) variant. I wouldn't expect the Z4 to be in production for more than another year and I doubt there will be a direct replacement. My wife and I just bought a 2013 35i with less than 20k miles for $40k (stickered new for $62.5k), which is right in line with your numbers. It is what it is; just be glad you didn't buy one new (or lease one and have nothing to show for it after 2-3 years and $20k of payments!). Drive the wheels off it and enjoy the experience. That's our plan!

[junglejett]

BMW's have never held their value very well.

[Nkc]

My z3 and 1M holds value quite well. The zed, well let's just say it was a business expense.

[paris1]

Originally Posted by junglejett

BMW's have never held their value very well.

I think this is particularly true for models that are made in Germany and are thus subject to ridiculously high labor cost content. The cars are simply not worth as much as they cost and this catches up to them sooner or later. That's why it makes much more sense to acquire one after it comes off lease. And even then the economics are questionable!

[jparnes1]

Originally Posted by paris1

I think this is particularly true for models that are made in Germany and are thus subject to ridiculously high labor cost content. The cars are simply not worth as much as they cost and this catches up to them sooner or later. That's why it makes much more sense to acquire one after it comes off lease. And even then the economics are questionable!

Speaking for the Z4 only, you can't compare its cost to other BMWs. Roadsters are a "want" car not a "need" car and as such are always priced at a premium. Plus they're a low volume seller and the price reflects that too.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by paris1

A BMW exec recently stated publicly that the market for expensive roadsters took a huge hit during the recession and they doubt it will ever recover. That's why they're working with Toyota to jointly develop a less expensive (Z2) variant. I wouldn't expect the Z4 to be in production for more than another year and I doubt there will be a direct replacement. My wife and I just bought a 2013 35i with less than 20k miles for $40k (stickered new for $62.5k), which is right in line with your numbers. It is what it is; just be glad you didn't buy one new (or lease one and have nothing to show for it after 2-3 years and $20k of payments!). Drive the wheels off it and enjoy the experience. That's our plan!

Check out the sales of the SL and Cayman/Boxster. The issue isn't with the market....

OP, I'm not sure what the problem is. If you sold now you would have had use for your car for 7k over the last 2.5 years. Great deal to drive a Z4 for such a low cost

Edit: It makes much more sense to get a 4 yrs old Kia hatch that's fully depreciated with 6 more years left of factory warranty.... but F that... life's too short for boring cars

[Lurcher]

My e38 (2001) suffered deprecation of ~$500 a month from the time I bought it (2004). Originally a $72k car, you can now buy for $3-4k

From what I'm experiencing on the e89, it's roughly dropping at ~$400 a month.

Blame the computers and the overall high maintenance costs. Once these things go out of warranty....

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by Lurcher

My e38 (2001) suffered deprecation of ~$500 a month from the time I bought it (2004).

From what I'm experiencing on the e89, it's roughly dropping at ~$400 a month.

Did you get them new? That depr expense is in the ballpark of lease expense

[paris1]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

Check out the sales of the SL and Cayman/Boxster. The issue isn't with the market....

I don't know about the SL (are their sales really that good?!), but Boxster/Caymen buyers are a different demographic than the Z4. Much more hard core performance oriented I would think. The Z4 these days is more of a luxury GT and that is where the softness is in the market, if BMW is correct in their assessment.

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by paris1

I don't know about the SL (are their sales really that good?!), but Boxster/Caymen buyers are a different demographic than the Z4. Much more hard core performance oriented I would think. The Z4 these days is more of a luxury GT and that is where the softness is in the market, if BMW is correct in their assessment.

Check this out.. 2013 units sold in USA

• SL 7k
• SLK 4.8k
• Boxster 4.5k
• Z4 2.5k

Sources:
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html
http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html


It's fair that one could look at this data and say that Z4, SL and SLK sales are all lower than their highs in the early 2000s, so the market is worsened.

I think it's also fair to say that last year Mercedes sold ~12k roadsters and Porsche sold 4.5k roadsters while BMW sold 2.5k roadsters, so the Z4 specifically is the laggard

Maybe that same exec who made the excuse about the roadster market signed off on the awful suspension tuning caused by 19" RE050A RFT, and the on track limp modes from lack of extra cooling. Z4 gets handicapped in performance testing and gets panned by the journos because it goes into power reduction and has sucky tires from the factory, Z4 gets handicapped in luxury car buyer test drives due to suspension crashing over minor bumps in the road.

No surprise to me the Z4 is a poor seller and it is such a wasted opportunity because BMW could have pulled the Michelin PSS, M performance brakes, 1M/335is cooling parts off the shelf and fielded a really competitive car that would have done much better in auto journalist reviews

[VailM3]

IF you think prices are steep there. My car stickered for 102k USD i got it for 51k and now its worth about 35k at max. Swiss cars are expensive. That being said for the 2 years and and 16k depreciation would i have changed a thing? No, love the 2011 35iS and I do plan on keeping it for at least another 3-5 years

[BMWZ4RIDER]

Originally Posted by jparnes1

Yes, that's what happens to a car's value over time...it goes down a lot. You have said that you plan to hold on to this car for a very long time. How can you possibly be losing your shirt? If you're not looking to sell, the car's value is of no concern. And are you saying that you would forfeit all the enjoyment you got from owning your car so you could buy it cheaper today? Sorry dude, your rant doesn't cut it for me.

I purchased the car used at a very good discount and do plan on holding on to it for a long time so, so the cuuernt depreciation is only on paper until I (IF) actually sell.
However to get the Z I had to sell my prized Acura TL-Type S- Fantastic car ( Not a Z However)

My 2008 Acura TL-Type S truly held the most incredible resale value of any car I have ever owned and was the absolute best buy and resale deal EVER.
I bought it brand new from an Acura dealer and sold private:
September 2008-End of the Model year, end of this 4 year Model run-2004-2008
2008 Acura TL-Type S 100% optioned out
MSRP-$39,740
Dealers last 2 - 2008's on the lot
Negotiated buy price $31,700-Save $8040
I put with my mods another $1200 into it for a total cost of $32,900
Faster forward to Sept 2012
Car has only 8450 miles on it and is perfect.
(Fall for the Z4 at the BMW Performance school)
Sell the Acura on line privately for $29950 Cash
My Depreciation over 4 ful years-$2,950/ 4= 737.50 year /12 months= $61.45 Month depreciation
Fantastic cost of ownership

The Z has lost in 5 years:
Oct 2009 OEM Purchase price MSRP $67,040
Oct 2014 Book Value Book $27,992
Dereciation from MSRP- $39,048/ 5 years= $7,809.60 year or $650.80 month depreciation PLUS PAYMENT if someone bought new. WOW

The Z should NOT depreciate and lose value over 10 times faster then an Acura.
$650 Month depreciation vs $61 Month for the Acura.
This is absurd.

My Cost of Owner ship ONLY IF I SOLD
Sept 2012- MY purchase price- $35,500
Dec 2014 Book- $27,992
Depreciation- $7508/ 2.25 year -$3,336.88 Year/ 12 months=$278.07 Month

The enjoyment factor cannoit be valued.'
However when you put the cost of ownership on paper it takes stops your heart.

[jparnes1]

So was it the car or did you find someone who was willing to overpay for a 4 year old car? I'm thinking the latter. And like I said, paper values don't mean s*it unless your selling. Maybe in 10 years the car will carry a good price because of its relative rarity. Who knows? But I wouldn't cry about it now.

[airmarc]

Originally Posted by jparnes1

So was it the car or did you find someone who was willing to overpay for a 4 year old car? I'm thinking the latter. And like I said, paper values don't mean s*it unless your selling. Maybe in 10 years the car will carry a good price because of its relative rarity. Who knows? But I wouldn't cry about it now.

Could not agree more

[Lurcher]

Originally Posted by nicknaz

Did you get them new? That depr expense is in the ballpark of lease expense

Nope. e38 2001- bought in June 2004 for $35k. Got totaled last year (RIP) but would have sold for $7 then (got $9k from insurance) or ~$5 now. Was worth every penny (about $1k a year in maintenance). So "cap cost" was $26k or ~$240 a month in the end

e89 was used too (2012 model bought in May 2013).

Someone else can take that first 1-2 year massive deprecation hit, but I hold onto cars typically for 8-10 yrs so things typically work out.

[Ozie]

My 2010 sDrive35is was $130k brand new. Bought it 2014 with 86000 km/53000 miles for $60k.

I had 2004 E85 Z4 2.2 earlier. Cost 2004 was $72k
Bought it 2010 with 52000 km/32000 miles for $32k
Sold it 2014 with 127000 km/790000 miles for $21k

First miles are damn expensive.

Ps. Welcome to Finland

[paris1]

Originally Posted by Ozie

My 2010 sDrive35is was $130k brand new. Bought it 2014 with 86000 km/53000 miles for $60k.

I had 2004 E85 Z4 2.2 earlier. Cost 2004 was $72k
Bought it 2010 with 52000 km/32000 miles for $32k
Sold it 2014 with 127000 km/790000 miles for $21k

First miles are damn expensive.

Ps. Welcome to Finland

WOW! What's the reason(s) for the inflated prices??

[Ozie]

Originally Posted by paris1

WOW! What's the reason(s) for the inflated prices??

sDrive35is with standard equipment is $63k
Then comes VAT 24% which is about $16k
Then there is temporary (should have been one year in 1958) car tax which is about $40k.

Total $119k

Car tax was a temporary tax for one year ...in 1958. Still going strong

[mbetoni]

Originally Posted by BMWZ4RIDER

However when you put the cost of ownership on paper it takes stops your heart.

I don't understand this at all, perhaps because I ordered new? The cost of ownership does not stop my heart in any way, I wanted the car, I wanted it new, I wanted it exactly the way I ordered it, and I paid for that. Never think/thought twice about it.

[Squddie]

I will join the Z4 club as a lease non-owner for this very reason. I got in with those insanely high residuals in the US in October. By the end of the lease BMW will "give" me -what- about 50% more than they can get for the used car?

It is quite sad because this thing drives so well, especially now that other new BMW can be quite challenged in the actual driving department.