New Z has arrived. Have questions.

Z4Andy · 07-08-2009, 08:44 PM

Hi all, just taken delivery (will get pics up soon).

However car has a couple of defects. Though dealer has been very fair so far.

Paint has lots of watermarks a scuff on the fuel filler cap and a chip on the passenger door handle.

Interior trim has some marks (scratches on the wood trim) and the dealer has promised faithfully to sort them but it would seem the car arrived at the dealer like this.

Non of this was pointed out to me though and I did have to mention it.

So I agree a course of action with the so far good dealer service but on the way home I could hear this tin type high frequency rattle coming from the nearside rear and when you open the arm rest it makes a very nasty crunch noise and catches on the USB interface somewhere upon closing which seems very cheaply made.

Any ideas of the above. Also what is the packing behind the front grill? Should this have been removed. It was dark by the time I got home so I really didn't get a good look in there.

Very disapointed with the standard stereo, though the bluetooth works great.

Had a nice drive home and managed some roof down time when the sun was out. Fuel computer showing 39.7 average mpg but I never ventured over 60 on the motorway.

Biggest distraction is the bonnet seemed to wobble as I drive. At first I thought it was open and pulled over to check.

Brakes seem very "clunky" at low speed. Handles well and the 19" wheels give a better ride than I thought they would.

I know this first post is a bit negative of the car, however I have just had the bad points on my mind from picking the car up and only 80 miles so far.

patrice03 · 07-09-2009, 12:18 AM

the wood seems to scratch very easily indeed, fuel consumption is anyway higher than bm figures, as for rattles, well ..welcome to the club.. build quality is not as expected, early production !

Z4 Beemer · 07-09-2009, 03:18 AM

Congrats on your new car, and sorry to hear of these niggles.

Hopefully the paintwork and interior trim can get sorted. If the scratches on the paintwork are not deep they should hopefully polish out. I had a slight scuff looking mark at the corner of the front bumper, but I think it was just shipping wax and it polished out fine. You didn't say what colour it is, but I know that my Deep Sea Blue does show up dirt quite easily, so I'm being ultra-cautious every time I wash it so as not to cause any swirl marks.

Regarding the rattle, is this when the roof is in place, or folded away? I initially thought that the interior bits of the roof trim were rattling/vibrating - see this post for the bits of trim I'm taking about:

http://e89.zpost.com/forums/showpost...1&postcount=21

but it seems it was the passenger seat, as someone else on here mentioned. Re-adjusting the seat has caused it to stop.

The centre armrest does have a sort of clunking noise when opened/closed but I thought it was just to ensure a tight fit.

There is indeed dark foam polystyrene type material behind the front grill - I think this is ok though!

I think the standard stereo sounds quite deep (too much bass) and have turned the bass down quite a bit, but other than that its ok for me.

I've never noticed the bonnet wobbling, but will look out for that when I'm out in the car later today!

Going from my 325i coupe to the Z4 I initially thought the brakes were quite soft and didn't have a lot of stopping power. After collecting at the dealers I nearly went through a red light! I think it was because they were just new and the pedal feel was slightly different. Hopefully yours will "bed-in" after a few hundred miles and as the manual says, then begin to work optimally!

Hope you get the issues sorted and would be good to see some pics of her!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z4Andy

Hi all, just taken delivery (will get pics up soon).

However car has a couple of defects. Though dealer has been very fair so far.

Paint has lots of watermarks a scuff on the fuel filler cap and a chip on the passenger door handle.

Interior trim has some marks (scratches on the wood trim) and the dealer has promised faithfully to sort them but it would seem the car arrived at the dealer like this.

Non of this was pointed out to me though and I did have to mention it.

So I agree a course of action with the so far good dealer service but on the way home I could hear this tin type high frequency rattle coming from the nearside rear and when you open the arm rest it makes a very nasty crunch noise and catches on the USB interface somewhere upon closing which seems very cheaply made.

Any ideas of the above. Also what is the packing behind the front grill? Should this have been removed. It was dark by the time I got home so I really didn't get a good look in there.

Very disapointed with the standard stereo, though the bluetooth works great.

Had a nice drive home and managed some roof down time when the sun was out. Fuel computer showing 39.7 average mpg but I never ventured over 60 on the motorway.

Biggest distraction is the bonnet seemed to wobble as I drive. At first I thought it was open and pulled over to check.

Brakes seem very "clunky" at low speed. Handles well and the 19" wheels give a better ride than I thought they would.

I know this first post is a bit negative of the car, however I have just had the bad points on my mind from picking the car up and only 80 miles so far.

Otago · 07-09-2009, 04:11 AM

I thought German workmanship excels US, Jap & France.

juhap · 07-09-2009, 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Otago

I thought German workmanship excels US, Jap & France.

Then again it would be interesting to know how many of the assembly line workers actually are native Germans. Not trying to be a racist here, just acknowledging cultural differences and the effect they have on all sorts of things.

teagueAMX · 07-09-2009, 06:18 AM

IMO German engineering tends to be better and they have a lot of creativity, but Japanese build quality is generally superior and beats any of the European makes.

A guy named Deming, a Bell Labs engineer, wrote a book on statistical quality control around WWII. Basically, US manufactures told him where to put it because as far as they were concerned "if ain't broke don't fix it".

The Japanese on the other hand were recovering from WWI and they ate it up, practically worshiped Deming. They turned around their industrial complex and made it into the powerhouse it is today because of his methods. Their fanatical dedication to his approach, I believe, is evident today in their products.

In the 50's/60's "Made in Japan" meant junk. By the 80's "Made in Japan" meant superior quality, and the US manufactures were taking major hits for poor build quality and horrendous gas mileage. Same holds true for European products. A friend owned a mid-1970's Jag and would tell me you couldn't afford to own one unless you did mechanical work. He took it out only on weekends and was prepared to re-tune the carbs and tinker with the electrical system every time. Today, IMO, European and US manufactures have been forced to improve quality only to remain competitive, not because they are dedicated to producing quality products nor do they pursue quality control methods for their own sake.

European and US philosophy: Every time you find a defect and send it back to the line or reject a part, it impacts your bottom line.

Japanese philosophy: Every time you don't find a defect and send it back to the line or reject a part, it impacts your bottom line.

patrice03 · 07-09-2009, 06:59 AM

I dont think the number of z4 non rattle-free should lead us to debate about build quality of german factory vs japanese or decline in bmw quality (not even the argument about none german - native workers.; hum hum.. ) .

Dont think it is a widely spread structural problem; but early production and roadster manufacturing, which by nature are more subject to rattles. the large bulk of bm production is "rattle-free". Another issue here perhaps is the impact of the crisis on quality control / staff motivation/ strikes etc.. , some companies witnessed in different industries a drop in quality..difficult to assess though

Otago · 07-09-2009, 08:56 AM

"Another issue here perhaps is the impact of the crisis on quality control / staff motivation/ strikes etc.. , some companies witnessed in different industries a drop in quality..difficult to assess though"

-Good Points

Nebraska99 · 07-09-2009, 10:22 AM

The workers better be motivated to build a quality product it they want to collect $60,000 from me.

teagueAMX · 07-09-2009, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patrice03

I dont think the number of z4 non rattle-free should lead us to debate about build quality of german factory vs japanese or decline in bmw quality (not even the argument about none german - native workers.; hum hum.. ) .

Dont think it is a widely spread structural problem; but early production and roadster manufacturing, which by nature are more subject to rattles. the large bulk of bm production is "rattle-free". Another issue here perhaps is the impact of the crisis on quality control / staff motivation/ strikes etc.. , some companies witnessed in different industries a drop in quality..difficult to assess though

+1

FWIW - my comment wasn't meant to disparage the Z4, nor was it issue specific. I was making a general statement in response to a post concerning the relative build quality of German v Japanese v US automobiles, which can apply equally to any number of models or cars.

I love the Z4.

Z4Andy · 07-11-2009, 06:08 PM

Well here it is....

Car went to the dealer for a full detail and they sorted a lot of the swirls and serious water spots. The chip on the door handle needs to be painted so I have come to an "arrangement" rather than open a can of worms.

The arm rest has to be replaced. The wood trim is also to be replaced and I have found another piece that is scratched

Most worryingly is the off side sill where it meets the rear wheel arch. It moves in and out slightly

A lose panel! Dealer doesn't know about this yet as I just found it whilst washing the car.

Stereo now has a buzzing speaker (stereo is poor anyway).

However had a wonderful sunset drive last night

. Really loving the Z now just wish I could get the niggles sorted yesterday.

Ohh and spot the Mini tax disc holder. Dealer must have run out of BMW items.

teagueAMX · 07-11-2009, 06:38 PM

Well, as the owner of the car you know it's faults, but from where I'm sitting, it beautiful.

Don't sweat the small stuff and enjoy!

JohnT · 07-12-2009, 01:32 AM

Thought I was the only one with problems, I also have a blemish on the paint work, about 5cm across and also scratches on trim just above the EHB. I notice these day after pick up, dealer said it will be sorted.
But the point is how come these problems weren't fixed during the PDI? Is it just in the UK the dealers let these problems go, and hope we don't spot them?

teagueAMX · 07-12-2009, 02:00 AM

I guess I'm curious how they get scratched and all banged up.

I'd hate to think they come out of the factory like that, so is it during shipping? But even then it sounds like half the ship's is crew is napping in the car on the way over.

JohnT · 07-12-2009, 01:27 PM

I can understand slight damage during transit, its just the dealer not picking it up and fixing it before you see it.

teagueAMX · 07-12-2009, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnT

I can understand slight damage during transit, its just the dealer not picking it up and fixing it before you see it.

True, but how you think the interior gets damaged - scratched wood?

Z4Andy · 07-12-2009, 04:20 PM

Still finding problems here......

Could some of you guys check the following on your cars.

The sill panel that runs up to the rear wheel arch. Just at the panel line where the wheel arch (rear wing) takes over. Tap here and see if it is loose. Mine is on right hand side.

Also the headlining has aquired a dark horizontal line, I think it might be hitting something when it folds away. Not very noticable but it might get worse.

Had a nother great drive today though, with 40 mpg average over 90 mile journey.

Z4 Beemer · 07-12-2009, 04:53 PM

I will check the panel you mention in the morning, but when I waxed the car during the week, I guess I might have noticed if anything was loose, and pretty sure the panel I think you mean was ok!

When the dealer showed me the roof folding away I paid close attention to see if the panels actually touched each other before they went into the boot, and thankfully there is quite a good gap. I was concerned the interior trim on the rear section would get dirty if it touched the exterior front section of the roof. I have the standard rooflining (I think the colour is actually called oyster) and there are definitely no marks on it. Could it be the boot tray that's got dirt on it?

Glad you had a good drive today!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z4Andy

Still finding problems here......

Could some of you guys check the following on your cars.

The sill panel that runs up to the rear wheel arch. Just at the panel line where the wheel arch (rear wing) takes over. Tap here and see if it is loose. Mine is on right hand side.

Also the headlining has aquired a dark horizontal line, I think it might be hitting something when it folds away. Not very noticable but it might get worse.

Had a nother great drive today though, with 40 mpg average over 90 mile journey.

Z4Andy · 07-12-2009, 07:05 PM

^^^^^Thanks for that.

Hope you don't have anything loose but i'd say you would have noticed it when you were waxing it.

I have no idea how they would fix this either. Apart from trim issues the car drives great.

Z4 Beemer · 07-13-2009, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z4Andy

^^^^^Thanks for that.

Hope you don't have anything loose but i'd say you would have noticed it when you were waxing it.

I have no idea how they would fix this either. Apart from trim issues the car drives great.

Just actually remembered to check this, and it seems pretty well fixed in place. Hopefully the dealer should be able to put this right for you (maybe just a clip or something not fixed properly....)

Z4Andy · 07-13-2009, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z4 Beemer

Just actually remembered to check this, and it seems pretty well fixed in place. Hopefully the dealer should be able to put this right for you (maybe just a clip or something not fixed properly....)

Ok thanks for that.

Really can't get enough of this car right now

. Had a blast up the North coast of County Antrim today, though the roof had to stay shut but at least now I know it doesn't leak

.

Thunder, lightning, torrential rain and sport setting

. Still returning an indicated 37 mpg.

The bonnet wobble is still noticable and that rattle returned. It's most certainly just behind my ear and the wife complained about it today on her side as well. Wonder if it's the seat belt rewind point?

Won't be driving it for the next couple of days

Z4 Beemer · 07-14-2009, 02:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z4Andy

Ok thanks for that.

Really can't get enough of this car right now

. Had a blast up the North coast of County Antrim today, though the roof had to stay shut but at least now I know it doesn't leak

.

Thunder, lightning, torrential rain and sport setting

. Still returning an indicated 37 mpg.

The bonnet wobble is still noticable and that rattle returned. It's most certainly just behind my ear and the wife complained about it today on her side as well. Wonder if it's the seat belt rewind point?

Won't be driving it for the next couple of days

Yes, the weathers not very good at the moment.

Try giving the passenger seat headrest a bit of a shove to see if it makes a difference.

07-08-2009, 08:44 PM	#1
Z4Andy Private First Class 10 Rep 170 Posts Drives: Z4 Sdrive 35iS Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Belfast iTrader: (0)	New Z has arrived. Have questions. Hi all, just taken delivery (will get pics up soon). However car has a couple of defects. Though dealer has been very fair so far. Paint has lots of watermarks a scuff on the fuel filler cap and a chip on the passenger door handle. Interior trim has some marks (scratches on the wood trim) and the dealer has promised faithfully to sort them but it would seem the car arrived at the dealer like this. Non of this was pointed out to me though and I did have to mention it. So I agree a course of action with the so far good dealer service but on the way home I could hear this tin type high frequency rattle coming from the nearside rear and when you open the arm rest it makes a very nasty crunch noise and catches on the USB interface somewhere upon closing which seems very cheaply made. Any ideas of the above. Also what is the packing behind the front grill? Should this have been removed. It was dark by the time I got home so I really didn't get a good look in there. Very disapointed with the standard stereo, though the bluetooth works great. Had a nice drive home and managed some roof down time when the sun was out. Fuel computer showing 39.7 average mpg but I never ventured over 60 on the motorway. Biggest distraction is the bonnet seemed to wobble as I drive. At first I thought it was open and pulled over to check. Brakes seem very "clunky" at low speed. Handles well and the 19" wheels give a better ride than I thought they would. I know this first post is a bit negative of the car, however I have just had the bad points on my mind from picking the car up and only 80 miles so far.
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07-09-2009, 12:18 AM	#2
patrice03 Private First Class 13 Rep 164 Posts Drives: z23 318d f30 Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: europe iTrader: (0)	the wood seems to scratch very easily indeed, fuel consumption is anyway higher than bm figures, as for rattles, well ..welcome to the club.. build quality is not as expected, early production !
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07-09-2009, 04:11 AM	#4
Otago Second Lieutenant 23 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 09 Z4 sDrive 30i manual Join Date: May 2009 Location: Hong Kong iTrader: (0)	I thought German workmanship excels US, Jap & France.
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07-09-2009, 06:18 AM	#6
teagueAMX Colonel 60 Rep 2,087 Posts Drives: Some are road worthy Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: So Cal, USA iTrader: (0)	IMO German engineering tends to be better and they have a lot of creativity, but Japanese build quality is generally superior and beats any of the European makes. A guy named Deming, a Bell Labs engineer, wrote a book on statistical quality control around WWII. Basically, US manufactures told him where to put it because as far as they were concerned "if ain't broke don't fix it". The Japanese on the other hand were recovering from WWI and they ate it up, practically worshiped Deming. They turned around their industrial complex and made it into the powerhouse it is today because of his methods. Their fanatical dedication to his approach, I believe, is evident today in their products. In the 50's/60's "Made in Japan" meant junk. By the 80's "Made in Japan" meant superior quality, and the US manufactures were taking major hits for poor build quality and horrendous gas mileage. Same holds true for European products. A friend owned a mid-1970's Jag and would tell me you couldn't afford to own one unless you did mechanical work. He took it out only on weekends and was prepared to re-tune the carbs and tinker with the electrical system every time. Today, IMO, European and US manufactures have been forced to improve quality only to remain competitive, not because they are dedicated to producing quality products nor do they pursue quality control methods for their own sake. European and US philosophy: Every time you find a defect and send it back to the line or reject a part, it impacts your bottom line. Japanese philosophy: Every time you don't find a defect and send it back to the line or reject a part, it impacts your bottom line. Last edited by teagueAMX; 07-09-2009 at 01:20 PM..
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07-09-2009, 06:59 AM	#7
patrice03 Private First Class 13 Rep 164 Posts Drives: z23 318d f30 Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: europe iTrader: (0)	I dont think the number of z4 non rattle-free should lead us to debate about build quality of german factory vs japanese or decline in bmw quality (not even the argument about none german - native workers.; hum hum.. ) . Dont think it is a widely spread structural problem; but early production and roadster manufacturing, which by nature are more subject to rattles. the large bulk of bm production is "rattle-free". Another issue here perhaps is the impact of the crisis on quality control / staff motivation/ strikes etc.. , some companies witnessed in different industries a drop in quality..difficult to assess though
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07-09-2009, 08:56 AM	#8
Otago Second Lieutenant 23 Rep 244 Posts Drives: 09 Z4 sDrive 30i manual Join Date: May 2009 Location: Hong Kong iTrader: (0)	"Another issue here perhaps is the impact of the crisis on quality control / staff motivation/ strikes etc.. , some companies witnessed in different industries a drop in quality..difficult to assess though" -Good Points
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07-09-2009, 10:22 AM	#9
Nebraska99 Enlisted Member 4 Rep 45 Posts Drives: CLK 500, RX350 Join Date: May 2009 Location: Belleville, IL iTrader: (0)	The workers better be motivated to build a quality product it they want to collect $60,000 from me.
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07-11-2009, 06:08 PM	#11
Z4Andy Private First Class 10 Rep 170 Posts Drives: Z4 Sdrive 35iS Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Belfast iTrader: (0)	Re: Well here it is.... Car went to the dealer for a full detail and they sorted a lot of the swirls and serious water spots. The chip on the door handle needs to be painted so I have come to an "arrangement" rather than open a can of worms. The arm rest has to be replaced. The wood trim is also to be replaced and I have found another piece that is scratched Most worryingly is the off side sill where it meets the rear wheel arch. It moves in and out slightly A lose panel! Dealer doesn't know about this yet as I just found it whilst washing the car. Stereo now has a buzzing speaker (stereo is poor anyway). However had a wonderful sunset drive last night . Really loving the Z now just wish I could get the niggles sorted yesterday. Ohh and spot the Mini tax disc holder. Dealer must have run out of BMW items.
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07-11-2009, 06:38 PM	#12
teagueAMX Colonel 60 Rep 2,087 Posts Drives: Some are road worthy Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: So Cal, USA iTrader: (0)	Well, as the owner of the car you know it's faults, but from where I'm sitting, it beautiful. Don't sweat the small stuff and enjoy!
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07-12-2009, 01:32 AM	#13
JohnT Private 4 Rep 79 Posts Drives: Z4 sDrive23i Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Yorkshire iTrader: (0)	Thought I was the only one with problems, I also have a blemish on the paint work, about 5cm across and also scratches on trim just above the EHB. I notice these day after pick up, dealer said it will be sorted. But the point is how come these problems weren't fixed during the PDI? Is it just in the UK the dealers let these problems go, and hope we don't spot them?
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07-12-2009, 02:00 AM	#14
teagueAMX Colonel 60 Rep 2,087 Posts Drives: Some are road worthy Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: So Cal, USA iTrader: (0)	I guess I'm curious how they get scratched and all banged up. I'd hate to think they come out of the factory like that, so is it during shipping? But even then it sounds like half the ship's is crew is napping in the car on the way over.
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07-12-2009, 01:27 PM	#15
JohnT Private 4 Rep 79 Posts Drives: Z4 sDrive23i Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Yorkshire iTrader: (0)	I can understand slight damage during transit, its just the dealer not picking it up and fixing it before you see it.
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07-12-2009, 04:20 PM	#17
Z4Andy Private First Class 10 Rep 170 Posts Drives: Z4 Sdrive 35iS Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Belfast iTrader: (0)	Still finding problems here...... Could some of you guys check the following on your cars. The sill panel that runs up to the rear wheel arch. Just at the panel line where the wheel arch (rear wing) takes over. Tap here and see if it is loose. Mine is on right hand side. Also the headlining has aquired a dark horizontal line, I think it might be hitting something when it folds away. Not very noticable but it might get worse. Had a nother great drive today though, with 40 mpg average over 90 mile journey.
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07-12-2009, 07:05 PM	#19
Z4Andy Private First Class 10 Rep 170 Posts Drives: Z4 Sdrive 35iS Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Belfast iTrader: (0)	Re: ^^^^^Thanks for that. Hope you don't have anything loose but i'd say you would have noticed it when you were waxing it. I have no idea how they would fix this either. Apart from trim issues the car drives great.
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