Why BMW Could Be the Winner in Volkswagen Diesel Scandal

[Shaw]

Why BMW Could Be the Winner in Volkswagen Diesel Scandal

http://247wallst.com/autos/2015/09/2...iesel-scandal/

Fewer Europeans will buy Volkswagen’s “clean diesel” cars even after the cheating software is removed. These include Audis, Porsches and Volkswagens proper. If Europeans are looking for a clean diesel German car, they will most likely move to BMW, which could gain the most from this debacle, assuming that BMW isn’t cheating just like Volkswagen. BMW has a 6.3% market share in Europe now. It may go up next quarter in taking some of Volkswagen’s share.

[overcoil]

Today's NewYorkTimes piece on the history of auto manufactures circumventing laws included this quote on the recent state of the industry "... In fact, the group’s testing found that the average diesel car was producing emissions five times as high as what was permitted. Some vehicles from BMW and Opel emitted 10 times as much pollution on the road as in the lab..."

[Matski]

Yeah, to be honest, the only reason I'm not revelling in VW's issues is because it's not big step for BMW to be next, and we don't have the cash and resources to stand that... welcome to the world of Toyota owned BMW!

[P1]

In many European countries, you pay taxes on how much your car pollutes. So the higher the pollution, the higher your taxes. It'll be interesting to see what will happen now that people have these cars that are dirtier than initially advertised, and if they'll get screwed on higher taxes.

[tc535i]

Originally Posted by P1et

In many European countries, you pay taxes on how much your car pollutes. So the higher the pollution, the higher your taxes. It'll be interesting to see what will happen now that people have these cars that are dirtier than initially advertised, and if they'll get screwed on higher taxes.

here in CA, there's talk about not allowing those car to renew registration, so people will have to buy a whole new car if it doesn't get sorted quick!

[P1]

Originally Posted by tc535i

here in CA, there's talk about not allowing those car to renew registration, so people will have to buy a whole new car if it doesn't get sorted quick!

I doubt that will fly, I cannot even imagine that. Either you get grandfathered into that car, or VW has to buy it back and either give you a prorated amount back or give you a replacement.

[rr006rbc]

This is gonna get uglier and uglier before it gets the slightest bit pretty for the VW/Porsche/Audi group..good luck to them boys in Germany.

[tc535i]

Originally Posted by P1et

I doubt that will fly, I cannot even imagine that. Either you get grandfathered into that car, or VW has to buy it back and either give you a prorated amount back or give you a replacement.

grandfathered in? that car should have never been legal, if they find it cheated the tests then it was never eligible for our roads.

that's vw's problem, not the DMV/EPA/CARB/etc. if they're gonna give a car, pay back, etc... it's gonna be at the end of a large class action lawsuit that I guarantee will not be quick.

[P1]

Originally Posted by tc535i

grandfathered in? that car should have never been legal, if they find it cheated the tests then it was never eligible for our roads.

that's vw's problem, not the DMV/EPA/CARB/etc. if they're gonna give a car, pay back, etc... it's gonna be at the end of a large class action lawsuit that I guarantee will not be quick.

What is the emission limit in CA, and how much above it are the VWs?

[tc535i]

Originally Posted by P1et

What is the emission limit in CA, and how much above it are the VWs?

not sure specifics, but I read road tests showed 40x NO limits established for that motor

[Dackelone]

"other" auto makers will be next.

A friend of mine suggested (to me) what IF Fiat Group uses this opportunity to swoop in and buy VAG thru a hostile taker over. Wouldn't THAT be something!!

We are in for some interesting automotive times in the next few weeks.

Dackel

[PrematureApex]

Originally Posted by tc535i

here in CA, there's talk about not allowing those car to renew registration, so people will have to buy a whole new car if it doesn't get sorted quick!

Originally Posted by P1et

I doubt that will fly, I cannot even imagine that. Either you get grandfathered into that car, or VW has to buy it back and either give you a prorated amount back or give you a replacement.

There's precedent for it in the US. 1970s mandatory air pump installs or no registration/inspection.

You'd have to think whatever VWs solution is, it will come with a mandate that all cars be fitted with it.

What they're trying to prevent is owners refusing to take their car in for a recall. Many don't want either decreased performance/or a "piss tank" installed in their cars. Many just want to keep them, untouched.

It's almost certain there will be something similar when the fix comes out. There's no way the EPA is simple going to allow owners not to fix them.

[Teutonic]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

"other" auto makers will be next.

A friend of mine suggested (to me) what IF Fiat Group uses this opportunity to swoop in and buy VAG thru a hostile taker over. Wouldn't THAT be something!!

We are in for some interesting automotive times in the next few weeks.

Dackel

It will never happen.

[larryn]

VAG might be a good 5 year investment, IF you buy at the bottom. It's still headed down.

[Ali Shiralian]

Fiat is not small, there's talk of them taking over GM. They have the cash to do it

[Ali Shiralian]

Report suggests automakers besides VW cheated emissions too
http://mashable.com/2015/09/23/emiss...er-automakers/

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Ali Shiralian

[Mord Mckee]

not sure about that:

http://www.autobild.de/artikel/absga...medium=twitter

[fecurtis]

Originally Posted by Shaw

Why BMW Could Be the Winner in Volkswagen Diesel Scandal.

http://247wallst.com/autos/2015/09/2...iesel-scandal/

If Europeans are looking for a clean diesel German car, they will most likely move to BMW, which could gain the most from this debacle, assuming that BMW isn’t cheating just like Volkswagen.

Quite the assumption given that they are also accused of cheating.

[fecurtis]

Originally Posted by Ali Shiralian

Fiat is not small, there's talk of them taking over GM.

They want to do a merger with GM but GM isn't interested in the slightest.

[PrematureApex]

Can the mods merge threads with the one in the BMW section? Two identical threads is ridiculous.

[PrematureApex]

Can the mods merge threads with the one in the non-BMW section? Two identical threads is ridiculous.

[ptack]

This could be BP oil spill big for VW. I highly doubt they have or can develop quickly any kind of fix that will greatly improve emissions to become compliant while maintaining advertised performance capabilities. Not only will they certainly be hit by some very large government fines, but the civil suits from owners will be huge. The biggest question though is what the German government and people will do. They can either try and shield VW or force through some dramatic changes including selling pieces off.