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      09-11-2014, 02:38 AM   #1
Asbjorn
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Comparing BMW "entry-level" performance and tunability as of 2014

I like to use the BMW China website to compare vehicles because they list actual weights INCLUDING automatic transmissions and commonly selected extra equipment (as well as a driver, luggage and fluids as required by the standard). This is because BMWs in China are imported with a fixed set of standard and extra equipment and always come with automatic transmissions as standard.

Here are the results I was able to dig up. In conclusion the Z4 is still a somewhat competitive performance offering due to maintaining the N54 engine and 7DCT combination. This is, if you do not regard piggies as real tuning options. In my (friend's) experience the JB4 still doesn't work properly with the new F-series 320hp N55 M135i.



Of course, when/if serious ECU flash tunes finally become available for these F-series cars, the conclusion won't be entirely the same.
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      09-11-2014, 04:45 AM   #2
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Honestly the weight and handling misfortunes of the Z4 should be enough to not be compared with those other cars. Excellent straight line performance (with tune mind you) but we all know driving dynamics isn't just about straight lines. Its a great value hard top convertible with plenty of power but lets not pretend that we're going against a Boxter.

The Z4 has always been an under-performer in terms of handling and what a BMW should be. It's gone soft and we E89er's know it. With the tune, the car is extremely nervous and unpredictable going from soft to hard and back to soft again. I had a lot of fun with the car but even when compared to my other current BMW's, it really doesn't have a purpose aside from looking pretty.

Sorry if I have rained on your parade Asbjorn.
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      09-11-2014, 10:27 AM   #3
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but some of us are ok with looking pretty
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      09-11-2014, 11:24 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nkc View Post
Honestly the weight and handling misfortunes of the Z4 should be enough to not be compared with those other cars.
? But but but as you can see, it is lighter than an M4!

And why would you want better handling, such as what you get from wider, stickier tires for example (looking at you boxter and 1M), when going sideways is so much more fun? The Z4 is way easier to get sideways than the Boxter. That is the kind of handling that matters to me.

In the traditional sense, better handling just equals higher G-forces and better lap times, and we all know F1 cars, although they handle like nothing else, are not necessarily the most fun cars to drive. Why so many people are striving for this "handling dream" is beyond me. It is a very uncomfortable dream...

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The Z4 has always been an under-performer in terms of handling and what a BMW should be. It's gone soft and we E89er's know it.
Well mostly because of the poor tires. But yes, it is more comfortable, but still not 3/5-series soft you know.

I can only speak for the standard non-adaptive suspension, but I do not think the Z4 feels too unpredictable. And certainly not too soft or hard for drifting.

Anyway, I would rather have something comfortable enough for longer trips than something which can do a slalom a few km/h faster. Especially when at the same time I can pull exactly the same drifts you see the M (performance) cars do. And yes, I am the kind of guy who sometimes wish the Z4 was even softer, feel free to shoot me... city roads here are terrible.

For me the purpose of the Z seems clear. It does not try to be a track monster or a lazy luxury convertible. It aims in-between, which what you should expect from a real roadster.
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      09-11-2014, 12:38 PM   #5
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      09-11-2014, 02:03 PM   #6
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I think it would just be a lot easier for us to agree to disagree.

I'm not even going to discuss your point on it being lighter than the M4. If you think a Z4 is even close to being compared to an M4 in terms of performance, handling, and fun factor then you really are drinking some really good coolaid.

You seem to think that the Z4 is the only car that can go sideways in the entire BMW lineup. Btw, I don't own a boxter. A Toyota FT86 would execute a drift quite easily and nicely too and that is an excellent handling/balanced car. If fun=drift then I guess I know nothing about fun with the Z3 and the 1M.

I get that you want something more comfortable for roads in China but I find it extremely hard to agree with you on what you should expect from a real roadster. It isn't an in-betweener and BMW should not be the ultimate compromise.

Aside from "drifting" the Z4, have you "drifted" anything else for you to conclude that the Z4 is 1) not unpredictable, 2) not too soft or hard for drifting and 3) in your opinion one of the better handling/fun cars in the BMW lineup?
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      09-11-2014, 02:34 PM   #7
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Lots of E89 koolaid in this thread.. love it!

I personally think the Z4 is playing in the cruiser market with the SL and SLK now and Z4 has a good combo of "good enough" handling, nice styling and good power (with a chip) to be a fun street car

@Nkc, what tires are you running and what size? I thought my car was really sketchy with the stock 19" RFT, with minor bumps upsetting the rear end of the car greatly. Going to 18" non RFT cleaned up that behavior a decent amount.
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      09-11-2014, 06:58 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nkc View Post
I'm not even going to discuss your point on it being lighter than the M4.
Because it is...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nkc View Post
If you think a Z4 is even close to being compared to an M4 in terms of performance, handling, and fun factor then you really are drinking some really good coolaid.
Regarding the performance, a tuned Z4 is within 10% of the power and torque-to-weight ratio of an M4. I think they can be compared. No-one will get hurt by that...

However, I never talked about handling in my first post, so I am not sure where that came from.

Regarding fun factor I wouldn't know, but some people think the M235i is more fun than the M4:

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1031404

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nkc View Post
You seem to think that the Z4 is the only car that can go sideways in the entire BMW lineup. Btw, I don't own a boxter. A Toyota FT86 would execute a drift quite easily and nicely too and that is an excellent handling/balanced car. If fun=drift then I guess I know nothing about fun with the Z3 and the 1M.
No, I do not think the Z4 is the only car that can go sideways in the entire BMW lineup. Not at all. And I also like the FT86 and 1M btw... But they are not in my comparison because I wanted to discuss current BMWs...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nkc View Post
I get that you want something more comfortable for roads in China but I find it extremely hard to agree with you on what you should expect from a real roadster. It isn't an in-betweener and BMW should not be the ultimate compromise.
Aside from "drifting" the Z4, have you "drifted" anything else for you to conclude that the Z4 is 1) not unpredictable, 2) not too soft or hard for drifting and 3) in your opinion one of the better handling/fun cars in the BMW lineup?
Well, you cannot have a cruiser and a track-monster at the same time. You have to compromise somewhere. Let's just agree to disagree where the ultimate compromise is.

Personally I am happy as long as my roadster isn't too uncomfortable for cruising, and isn't too unbalanced or grippy to drift at "normal" speeds. For example, if I owned a stock E93 M3 I do not think I would be able to drift as much as I can in the Z4. It is probably too grippy, and doesn't offer enough torque.

In this thread I was simply highlighting the power to weight "performance" numbers because they finally came online for the new M3/M4 on the Chinese website.

I know for a fact that even my friend's M135i is much harder/less comfortable than my Z4 and that it must corner/slalom better. But suspension components are so much cheaper to change compared to engines and overall weight, so I still think this thread is relevant, no matter what suspension/tires/handling we prefer.

Much more importantly though, inside both the Z4 and the M135i you can find these little drift monsters, and I am sure the same is true for the M235i and the new M3/M4.

Last edited by Asbjorn; 09-11-2014 at 07:13 PM..
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      09-11-2014, 09:25 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asbjorn View Post
Regarding fun factor I wouldn't know, but some people think the M235i is more fun than the M4:

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1031404
It seems like those people are the ones who got the 235 for cost reasons.....

(in fairness, I'm not one to talk since I got E89 instead of Porsche for cost reasons too....)
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      09-11-2014, 11:56 PM   #10
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I don't have much experience driving sporty cars but I do agree w/ some of the various pts. The car is overall a great performer in terms of being a luxury GT w/ sporty aspects: I don't think that it is a compromise because they were trying to be more SL and less Boxster, but I personally would've preferred to have a newer version of the E86 Z4 M. The stock suspension is set nicely, not too soft so that one can't feel the road but not too hard to be jarring. Having driven in more tight twisty roads and w/ worse pavement conditions, the Z4 handles itself admirably and I never felt nervous pushing it. However, even I could feel the weight of the car and wished that it was as light/small as our predecessor. Coming from a RSX, the stock power is enough for me atm (esp w/ the lousy cops and risk of major jumps in insurance for speeding violations).
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      09-12-2014, 12:41 AM   #11
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I suspect the handling of the Z4 can be greatly improved with
  • a good set of coil overs (e.g., KW v3)
    .
  • 18" performance tires (e.g., Michelin PSS)
    .
  • an LSD
    .
  • a good alignment
    .
  • perhaps some sway bars

I am a set of downpipes and a Cobb Pro tune away from maxing out the power for my Z4 (I won't be doing any meth). I don't feel the car is unstable or unsettled at all, at least no more than it was with the stock power levels.

I think a lot of people are fooled by the Z4's looks into thinking it will be a serious track or performance car out of the box, when it's no more suited for the track than a stock 335i.

Unfortunately, as with all N54/N55 cars, while massive power increases can be had cheaply and easily, maximizing the handling takes more effort. To me, it's worth the effort because, short of an E92 M3 or an E85 Z4M, there is no better looking car in BMW's lineup than a nicely equipped Z4.
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      09-12-2014, 04:03 AM   #12
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The difference Michelin PSS make is night and day on the e89.

I still think the e89 is the best looking automobile BMW currently make. Much nicer front end than the new 3-series design which I feel was a step back from the e9x.
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